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Just an observation

    General discussion

  • Interesting that, of all these forums for Windows 7, the Security forum has the lowest number of threads and messages.

    Is Security a lessor concern than it should be, or is it better than the industry portrays it?

    Doc
    Monday, April 20, 2009 3:10 PM

All replies

  • Yes, and yes.

    seltsameliebe
    Monday, April 20, 2009 3:33 PM
  • I have always believed that security is an illusion...

    Doc
    Monday, April 20, 2009 4:06 PM
  • A very interesting perspective, and refreshing discussion.

    seltsameliebe
    Monday, April 20, 2009 4:31 PM
  • Just a discussion on security and W7.  Why is it that so many of the anti-virus providers seem to be from eastern Europe?

    And, why do so many users feel comfortable using a free anti-virus product?

    My experience with some of these providers is that they know, personally, the guys who write the viruses...

    Doc

    Monday, April 20, 2009 4:46 PM
  • egads

    Security software is off topic for this discussion.

    I think that Doc's intention was to discuss the core, built-in security components for Windows 7.

    If you wish to discuss One Care, the Application Compatibility, or Miscellaneous forum would be a better choice. You could even reply to the thread that contained the quote you found. You could also try the Live One Care Team Blog for more information.

    Hope this helps.


    Ronnie Vernon MVP

    Monday, April 20, 2009 5:00 PM
  • My concern is that there were few postings in this forum regarding security (compared with the larger number of postings in the other forums).  We hear all too often about security concerns, and lack of security, and "hackability".

    I found it curious that there were not more who were concerned about such things.  Additionally, the number of people who tend to flock to "free" anti-virus and anti-spyware products.  Now, the touchy area is that many of these products seem to originate in eastern Europe.  And, as a matter of actual experience, I was deeply involved in a major effort with the US government and several anti-virus providers.  During our side discussions, I found that they (the anti-virus providers) actually know many of the virus writers on a personal level.

    Just curious about such things...

    Doc

    Monday, April 20, 2009 5:11 PM
  • Interesting that, of all these forums for Windows 7, the Security forum has the lowest number of threads and messages.

    Is Security a lessor concern than it should be, or is it better than the industry portrays it?

    Doc

    Hi Doc

    My thoughts.

    It is a lesser concern in the context that, since Vista, security is much better in Windows. If you look at the history, and the mostly unsecure nature of Windows, up to and including Windows XP, I think that users do feel much safer today.

    Hope this helps.


    Ronnie Vernon MVP
    Monday, April 20, 2009 5:13 PM

  • My paranoia goes in the opposite direction, Doc.

    When Netscape originally began sidestepping HTML 1.0 (albeit creatively), I was worried then that it was a deliberate backdoor for large software and O/S vendors (even government) to control our computers remotely.

    Ten years later, it's all the above.  And FUD.


    Proprietary extensions have long been the hooks that vendors want to use to lock you to their product, and why they eventually fail.

    Doc
    Monday, April 20, 2009 5:25 PM
  • Now, the touchy area is that many of these products seem to originate in eastern Europe. 
    Doc


    The Hanover Hacker and Robert Morris Jr were an ocean apart.

    seltsameliebe
    Monday, April 20, 2009 5:29 PM
  • The Hanover Hacker and Robert Morris Jr were an ocean apart.

    seltsameliebe

    Yes, and more than a decade and a few operating systems ago.  So, what about discussions on security and W7, and the "free" products out there to protect the user who cannot resist clicking on some link, or free offer, or scareware?

    Doc
    Monday, April 20, 2009 5:37 PM

  • Would you say I'm paranoid when I tell you I've taped an opaque paper flap over my Web Cam ?

    Seriously, I flip it away when I want to use it.  Else it's covered.

    Creepy.


    No, not paranoid.  Just overly aware of what can be done with all of the hooks and extensions built into software under the guise of "providing capability" that users want and need.

    Doc
    Monday, April 20, 2009 5:41 PM

  • What I mentioned above (that seems to be fading in and out) is that with xml and scripts, you can just visit a site and get commandeered or infected.

    You don't need to click anything.


    And without a firewall, any goofball from anywhere in the world can address your IP, find a live port, and instruct Windows to do plenty.


    So, it has nothing to do with users proactively doing anything.


    Yes, it is an unsafe world out there with bad people who have nothing better to do than mess with your computer and scam you.  All users need helmets and kneepads (and a known good backup).

    Doc
    Monday, April 20, 2009 5:51 PM

  • Windows XP (secured properly) and up are fairly secure.  One highly effective way to secure yourself is get behind a hardware NAT router or hardware firewall.  Most security issues are caused by end user ignorance.  Most of us have no reason to worry about hackers, to presume we have anything they might find interesting is, well somewhat conceited.  It is friends and family you really have to worry about, and their lack of computer savvy if you allow them to use your computer.

    If you have teenage kids, or are one yourself, it is your friends at school who may have too much ambition for their own good who you will also have to be careful about.  Windows 7 finally has put a cap on Autorun code for flashkeys, but you still have to be careful in public educational facilities when you exchange data with their systems.  Get a flash key that has a simple write protect switch; mine has saved me a on more than a few occasions using public systems.

    Almost no one uses properly setup user accounts.  the information is there, and there are even warnings aplenty in the Windows help system.  People are lazy.  I would say that malware and rootkits pose a significantly higher threat to 90% of end users than hackers do.  People still use OS bound browsers and download piles of illegal software and media.  In real life, if you frequent the back alleys and deserted factories where high risk crominal behaviour is more likely, you will get little sympathy from the authorities or your friends when you become a statistic.  Why should it be any different in the virtual world we all use and abuse?

    Eastern countries create better anti-virus applications, because perhaps they are more concerned with quality, than making a fast buck and bloating code like their western counterparts.  Sure the East provides us with many of the illegal content that is out there, but people there have a different mentality to learning and using a computer.  Most people in the west learn the minimum they need to do their job; laziness and too much real life bloat to be able to focus properly.  In the West, people who work in IT tend to be much more avid and spend much more time honing their skills and experimenting than we in the West do.  I doubt most hackers spend all day playing foolish market research games on Facebook and other community Websites.  They make better Antivirus programmes for the same reason they make better cars, and machinery, they CARE about their work, and have a sense of ownership and pride in the quality of their tasks.  I am not saying there are not likewise minded people in the West, it is just that they are not the norm.

    I have been in the IT field on and off for 27 years.  You see a lot of things come and go.  And today, the security of computers HAS vastly improved and so has the usability.  You cannot have bigger windows and more light in your house without making the walls weaker.

    Computer software consultant for 28 years
    Thursday, May 07, 2009 5:15 PM
  • I agree With Kieseyhow very much All systems can be hack and get viruses. The only reason MAC's and Linux, Unix seen so safe is that they only make up a small precent of users. I haker or Programmer of Viruses are looking for a bigger bang so they work mostly on hitting Windows systems.

    If you want to hurt a corporation then you can hit the hardest with a virus for windows not a mac or linux.


    cause Mac and Linux are not as speical as everybody thinks. they only have a different File format and Core operating system.


    Thursday, May 14, 2009 6:05 AM
  • So far, Windows 7 appears to be quite a reliable experience as far as security is concerned.  I like the subtle changes to the UAC (User Account Control), and also to the enhanced features in regards to preventing curruption and replacement of system files and folders as a consequence of lazy and ignorant programmers, or outdated software.

    something that I have heard about recently is the apparent level of security of Windows in comparison with Apple's latest OS, Snow Leopard.  Windows seems to come out on top for security, and very pleasing change considering the availabilty and populatity of Windows in comparison with Apple in the average business environment.  Here are some links for further reading:

    Windows 7 Will Mostly Be More Secure Than Leopard

    Windows 7 Better than Mac OS X Leopard in Security, Says Microsoft COO

    If Vista is now "the safest OS on the planet," so will Windows 7 be, according to Kevin Turner


    However, security aspects aside, with the release of Apple's OpenCL, Microsoft may have some catching up to do along the performance line.
    Computer software consultant for 27 years
    Monday, May 25, 2009 2:38 AM