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Microsoft Hyper-V Server “8” Beta Evaluation - User Experience Totally Sucks

    Frage

  • OK - I have been trying for over 8 hours unsuccessfully to get something working and I am not yet successful.

    After installing they hypervisor and logging in you get two windows (1) a basic command window and (2) sconfig.cmd window.

    sconfig.cmd does not have enough capabilities to get you bootstrapped far enough to connect with Hyper-V Manager from a remote Windows 8 client. I keep getting

    Access Denied. Unable to establish communication between 'HYPER8' and 'LABATT'

    Where LABATT is my Windows 8 client running Hyper-V Manager and HYPER8 is my system running Microsoft Hyper-V Server “8”

    Both systems are in the default WORKGROUP, using the Administrator account with the same password.

    I have been reading dozens of different documents people have been pointing me to, but they are all confusing, misleading, and not helpful in the slightest degree. Someone needs to write a really good, clear quick start document that takes you through the basics of how

    1. initially configure Microsoft Hyper-V Server “8”
    2. enable Hyper-V Manager on a Windows 8 client
    3. and just get it so that you can connect from  the Windows 8 client to the Hyper-V Server (hypervisor)
    4. basic trouble shooting - like what to do when you get "Access Denied. Unable to establish communication between 'HYPER8' and 'LABATT'"

    It simply does not matter how wonderful a product is if users are unable to make it work - especially when evaluating.

    - Eric

    Freitag, 16. März 2012 22:01

Antworten

Alle Antworten

  • Have you disabled the firewall or make the appropiate changes on server's firewall?.

    Can you ping the server from your workstation?

    Samstag, 17. März 2012 00:28
  • did you try this http://mythoughtsonit.com/?p=1056 ?

    Also check similar thread

    social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/winserverhyperv/thread/fca8008c-bde4-4d8d-9977-6ead09f70610/


    Mohamed Fawzi | http://fawzi.wordpress.com

    Samstag, 17. März 2012 00:33
  • OK - I have been trying for over 8 hours unsuccessfully to get something working and I am not yet successful.

    After installing they hypervisor and logging in you get two windows (1) a basic command window and (2) sconfig.cmd window.

    sconfig.cmd does not have enough capabilities to get you bootstrapped far enough to connect with Hyper-V Manager from a remote Windows 8 client. I keep getting

    Access Denied. Unable to establish communication between 'HYPER8' and 'LABATT'

    Where LABATT is my Windows 8 client running Hyper-V Manager and HYPER8 is my system running Microsoft Hyper-V Server “8”

    Both systems are in the default WORKGROUP, using the Administrator account with the same password.

    I have been reading dozens of different documents people have been pointing me to, but they are all confusing, misleading, and not helpful in the slightest degree. Someone needs to write a really good, clear quick start document that takes you through the basics of how

    1. initially configure Microsoft Hyper-V Server “8”
    2. enable Hyper-V Manager on a Windows 8 client
    3. and just get it so that you can connect from  the Windows 8 client to the Hyper-V Server (hypervisor)
    4. basic trouble shooting - like what to do when you get "Access Denied. Unable to establish communication between 'HYPER8' and 'LABATT'"

    It simply does not matter how wonderful a product is if users are unable to make it work - especially when evaluating.

    - Eric

    Sure, when you put it like that (1. 2. 3.) it sounds simple. If you had ever done just that with the previous version you would realize that it is far from that! I hate to think how many forum topics and blogs there are on how to get the Hyper-V Manager running in the client OS to control machines on a Hyper-V server.

      Here is a sample.

    http://blogs.technet.com/b/jhoward/archive/2008/11/14/configure-hyper-v-remote-management-in-seconds.aspx


    Bill

    Samstag, 17. März 2012 01:02
  • Have you disabled the firewall or make the appropiate changes on server's firewall?.

    Can you ping the server from your workstation?

    I ran the following command on the Hyper-V Server “8” system.

    netsh advfirewall firewall set rule group=“Windows Management Instrumentation (WMI)” new enable=yes

    Yes, I can ping the server just fine from my workstation.

    Cheers, Eric

    Samstag, 17. März 2012 14:47
  • Bill, I have read the blog article you cited, but I am trying not to have to download and install special tools to do this. If Microsoft were doing their jobs properly no-one should have to download and install any special tools - this should just work correctly out of the box.

    Microsoft are loosing a great opportunity here to have people evaluate Hyper-V, especially if they have never used Hyper-V before. I have experience with VMWare, and use VMWare Workstation all the time, and I have never had so much trouble with it as I am having with Hyper-V. I have also used Oracle's Virtual Box a bit, and while it was easy to use, I found some bugs in the virtualization that made it unusable for the particular task I was doing. The point is (if anyone from Microsoft cares) if you want people to try your new products you should lower the barriers to success. It is completely unacceptable the hours I have spent searching for help, reading the "many forum topics and blogs there are on how to get the Hyper-V Manager running in the client OS to control machines on a Hyper-V serve." as Bill says.

    Microsoft seem to have an internal corporate culture problem - they have no people in the company who know how to make things simple, how to think in simpler terms, or how to give their customers new technology that is simple and straightforward to get working. The biggest problem with administering Windows technology is that Microsoft want to make money from all there sysadmin training courses they offer so there is only an incentive to keep things as complicated as possible.

    Cheers, Eric

    Samstag, 17. März 2012 15:04
  • Ok, firewall is fine.

    Try to put both, server and computer, in a domain, (same domain, of course) and then try to connect to.

    Post the results.

    Also, read the Events and post the error codes here.

    Good luck.

    Dienstag, 20. März 2012 15:09
  • Are you saying this cannot work if both the client and server are in the default WORKGROUP, and not in a domain with a domain controller?

    I am trying to evaluate Hyper-V Server "8" and I do not have access to a domain controller. Are you saying I need to bring up a domain controller in order to evaluate Hyper-V Server "8" ?

    Cheers, Eric

    Dienstag, 20. März 2012 15:44
  • Just saying to create a domain. I want to see if that will work.

    If not, we can move on. Can you give it a try?

    Dienstag, 20. März 2012 17:42
  • I have never created a domain before. How hard is it to do?

    I would rather move on on try something that requires less work.

    What other reasons are there that should cause access denied?

    Both systems are in the default WORKGROUP, both systems are using the Administrator account with the same password.

    Could this be a NAT problem because my Windows 8 client is running in a VMWare virtual machine, which in turn in running in my home computer at the other end of a VPN link to our corporate intranet where my Hyper-V Server "8" system is running?

    Cheers, Eric

    Dienstag, 20. März 2012 18:07
  • Not hard. Just create a domain X and join your server and computer to the same domain.

    About the different location, can you make both, server and win 8, in the same LAN? Without any VPN link.

    another thing, Can you try using VMM 2012 beta to manage the server?..

    Dienstag, 20. März 2012 18:19
  • "Could this be a NAT problem because my Windows 8 client is running in a VMWare virtual machine, which in turn in running in my home computer at the other end of a VPN link to our corporate intranet where my Hyper-V Server "8" system is running?"

    Seriously? That is your environment?

    I think you just described the root cause(s) of your issues. What happens when you run both the Win8's on the same network, no VPN, no NAT?

    Dienstag, 20. März 2012 19:21
  • Seriously, there is nothing wrong with such an environment - my expectation is that if there is something wrong with that environment then Microsoft have not adequately tested their software.

    So, this morning I spent several hours refining my environment.

    1. I upgraded my local VMWare Workstation to version 8.02
    2. I installed Windows 8 Consumer Preview in a new VM with a bridged network (no NAT, no VPN)
    3. I enabled the Administrator account and changed the password to match my Hyper-V Server "8" Beta system (hyper8)
    4. I tested that I can ping "hyper8" from the Windows 8 Client
    5. I tried connecting to hyper8 from the Hyper-V Management application
    6. I get exactly the same error as before - access denied.
    7. Both systems are in the same default WORKGROUP and on the same LAN.

    Any other suggestions?

    Cheers, Eric

    Mittwoch, 21. März 2012 18:52
  • Yes, install a DC and then join Hyper V and your desktop to it.

    Hyper V has issues running on workgroups, and, you will end up working on Domain, right?

    Why are you testing it for workgroups?.. Any special bussiness requirements?..

    Any way, there are ways to make this work:

    http://blogs.technet.com/b/jhoward/archive/2008/03/28/part-1-hyper-v-remote-management-you-do-not-have-the-requested-permission-to-complete-this-task-contact-the-administrator-of-the-authorization-policy-for-the-computer-computername.aspx

    Or use this tool: HVRemote

    http://archive.msdn.microsoft.com/HVRemote

    But, Seriously, do not do it. Just use a domain, as you would on a production enviroment.

    Mittwoch, 21. März 2012 19:28
  • OK, I got some things working using HVRemote, but it was not straightforward. Thanks Alexito for giving me a solution that works.

    1. You need to appreciate that Hyper-V Server "8" is the bare minimum to run Hyper-V, so the cmd and sconfig.cmd is about all you have - NO GUI.
    2. To install HVRemote I had to use Remote Desktop to the hypervisor
    3. Then I used notepad hvremote.wsf to create the file
    4. I copied the text from another window into notepad and saved it
    5. On the server I ran: cscript hvremote.wsf /add:HYPER8\Administrator
    6. Rebooted hyper8
    7. On the client I ran: cscript hvremote.wsf /anondcom:grant
    8. Finally I ran the Hyper-V Manager and I was able to connect to 'hyper8'

    Basically the functionality of hvremote.wsf should be added to sconfig.cmd, for a better user experience. Also, the sine qua non is "Hyper V has issues running on workgroups." For evaluation purposes it should should be dirt simple to evaluate Hyper-V in such an environment - no-one should have to jump through as many hoops as I had to.

    I tried creating a Virtual Machine via Hyper-V Manager - the indeterminate progress bar has been going back and forth for about 30 minutes now "Creating disk..." - which can only mean something is hosed. When you create a virtual disk on VMWare you get an actual progress bar that 'progresses'. The disk activity LED on the system is not even blinking any more.

    Overall the feel of Hyper-V is really sucky - it seems more like prototype software not commercial software. Compared to VMWare and Hyper-Box the Hyper-V user interface is terrible - confusing, incomplete, uninformative.

    Verdict: Hyper-V Server "8" is not even close to being 'beta' quality software - it is more like an 'alpha' experiment.

    Epilog - you only ever get one chance to make a first impression, and now I will always remember my first impression of Hyper-V.

    Mittwoch, 21. März 2012 23:19
  • While I agree that the Hyper-V server setup is more complicated than it needs to be, I want to counter-point your other statements.

    Yes, it is still in beta, it is not a final product. 

    Hyper-V server is a server virtualization product, you can't compare it to VMWare Workstation or Virtualbox which are client virtualization applications running on the same OS and have full GUI interfaces.  If you are looking for a client virtualization product, you should compare apples to apples and install the Windows 8 consumer preview and use the Hyper-V role.  This provides a GUI interface for you.  Alternately, if you want a GUI based product, use the Windows 8 preview which provides you with the full Windows interface.

    Comparable products, like ESXi from VMWare, don't provide a GUI interface on the server.  You need another computer to configure, manage, and create VMs in ESXi.

    Not really sure how you can justify an opinion on an unfinished, beta, product.

    Freitag, 23. März 2012 20:44
  • Not only is Hyper-V Server setup more complicated than it needs to be, but there simply does not exist any good getting started information for the most basic evaluation cases. There should be a link to a 'Getting Started' page right next to the download button so you can see what you are getting into before you click 'Download'. Everyone who writes about Hyper-V, including Microsoft, seems to think that 'hacking' is fun, like it is a hobby or something.

    Regarding Beta products, my impression is that the quality does not meet what I would expect from a beta release, it is closer to an alpha release in quality and should be branded that way to set the user's expectations accordingly.

    When I was comparing VMWare Workstation and VirtualBox I was comparing the user interface to what I saw in Hyper-V Manager - not to my command line experience in the hypervisor. The Hyper-V Manager GUI is too confusing and in the case of running on Windows 8 Client it is just plain broken - after several attempts to create a new virtual machine I could not because the wizard would just never complete the process of creating a new virtual disk - the indefinite progress bar would just run forever - at a minimum it should progress within the first 10 seconds.

    I can justify an opinion on an unfinished beta product because when I release a beta product it is a lot more finished that what I have seen here. When I release an alpha product it is proof of technology and expected to be unfinished. Beta products must be stable enough to simply do the most basic things correctly without incident, and that is not the case with Hyper-V Server "8". Beta tests are for discovering the edge cases that slipped by the Development and Quality Assurance teams - because invariably real users will think of things the developers and testers did not. Obviously my standards for 'beta' are much higher than Microsoft's.

    • Als Antwort vorgeschlagen elimiz Freitag, 20. April 2012 06:09
    • Nicht als Antwort vorgeschlagen elimiz Freitag, 20. April 2012 06:09
    Freitag, 23. März 2012 21:26