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Hyper-v and very slow network

Proposed Hyper-v and very slow network

  • 2011年4月1日 下午 10:01
     
     
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    Dear all,

    I have a big problem with my hyper-v server and network card. I've found a lot of topic around this question but none of them helped me.

    I have a Win 2008 R2 Server with only Hyper-V installed. I have 3 NIC , one is reserved to the host management and the others two are reserved for virtual machine .

    All NIC are Intel, one is integrated on the Intel motherboard and the others are Intel Gigabit ET Dual port .

    Before installing the role of Hyper-V all NIC worked perfectly with speed around 1Gb (file transfer average 90 MB/Sec, of course I have a Gigabit LAN) .

    After Hyper-V install, the host system  is going very slow and the network file transfer using the dedicated NIC is about ten time slower (9-10MB /sec) . Same problem with all VM off and also if I remove all VM !

    I tried all of suggestion found in old post (disabling TCP checksum / offload ...) but nothing happens.

    What is really strange is that by removing all network card all the Host operating system seems to improve the speed... but, of course, I can't use  my LAN :(

    I need help because every night I must make a full backup of Virtual hard disk from the host to a backup server in my lan.

    My configuration:

    - Server Win 2008 R2 SP1 with Hyper-V and no others role

    - 2 Virtual Machine (one Win 2008 R2 and one Win 7 Ultimate)

    - NAS Linux (access via SMB with no problem)

    - Various Windows 7 Pro client

     

    Thanks in advance to everybody,

    Luca M.

     

所有回覆

  • 2011年4月1日 下午 11:14
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    What network adapter are you using?  Have you got the latest network drivers from the manufacturer?  Is it possible to try a different network adapter?
    Cheers,
    Benjamin Armstrong
    ============================
    Windows Virtualization
    Senior Lead Program Manager

    This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights. You assume all risk for your use.
     
  • 2011年4月2日 下午 08:59
     
     
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    Ben and Luca, Thanks for posting. 

    We are having almost the exact same issue. We also need help.  High urgency.

    We have tried all of the suggestions above. Mutiple clean installs with latest drivers, BIOS, Etc.
    Without Hyper-V 90MB/s network copy speed.  With Hyper-V on the Host 9MB/s
    Windows 2008 R2 SP1 Enterprise, MotherBoard Intel S5520HCR, 48GB RAM,  Dual CPU

    Thanks - John Webster
    john.webster@netsupport.com

     
  • 2011年4月3日 上午 09:29
     
     
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    Dear Ben,

    I'm using Intel Gigabit ET Dual port network adapter (http://www.intel.com/products/server/adapters/gb-ET-Dual-Port/gb-ET-Dual-Port-overview.htm)

    I've tried with another Intel NIC too but I have the same problem.

    I'm using the latest driver, bios etc.

    Any idea?

    Thanks for any help with this!

     

    Luca M.

     
  • 2011年4月4日 上午 12:18
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    Were you seeing this problem before installing SP1?
    Cheers,
    Benjamin Armstrong
    ============================
    Windows Virtualization
    Senior Lead Program Manager

    This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights. You assume all risk for your use.
     
  • 2011年4月4日 下午 01:34
     
     
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    I've installed hyper-v after SP1 , so I can't know if this problem is linked to the service pack .

    But now I'm 100% sure that this issue is caused by Hyper-V , and it not depend by the nic... : if I disable the role in the host (bcdedit /set hypervisorlaunchtype off ) , after reboot my file trasfer are:

    - in local (copy/paste a big file in my phisical local disk) : 338 MB / sec

    - in LAN (from my NAS to the Host OS running Hyper V) : 116 MB / sec

    When I re-enable Hyper-V, the speeds become:

    - in local: 98 MB/sec

    - in LAN: 10,5 MB/sec

    The problem disappear also if I boot in safe mode with networking .

    I have a RAID 6 with 4 SSD and a megaraid 8161 sata II controller, I can reach sometimes 400 MB /sec so I think the problem is not related to hard drive.

    My CPU is an Intel I7 980X .

    I noticed that when hyper-v is enabled and I start a file transfer my cpu usage increase a lot, sometimes it reaches 80-90% !

    Any idea with this new information?

    Really thanks to your support.

    Luca M.

     

    EDIT:

    I confirm that the problem isn't related to the network adapter. Now if I try by removing all NIC the internal trasfer speed (copy/past from physical disk) still remains slow (near 100 MB / sec) .

    I'm thinking about some BIOS setting wrong... but virtulization functions are all enabled...

    Please help me!


     
  • 2011年4月4日 下午 02:43
     
     
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    Ben Luca, thanks for the posts. 

    We  are still having the issue as well.

    We have tried 5 separate installs of the Server OS. 
    Three different people have done the installs.
    We have used 2008 R2 SP1 Ent, 2008 R2  SP1 Std,  2008 R2 Ent, 2008 R2 Ent with SP1 installed later via update.
    Is does not seem to be SP1 specific.  We have tried with and without the additional Intel 4 Port NICs.
    We have done BOIS updates, used default drivers, and the most current ones off the intel site.
    We have tried the changes to the TCP offload settings. 

    The only constant is that once we enable the Hyper-V role the copy slows way down.
    Also, the server slows down just opening windows.  
    There are brief periods of time that we thought we had it fixed, but the problem reappears.

    We have boxed the server up and sending back to the shop today for more detailed testing.
    Please let me know how we can work together to resolve this urgent issue?

    Thanks - John Webster
    john.webster@netsupport.com 

     

     

     
  • 2011年4月4日 下午 02:45
     
     
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    Dear John,

    can you write your hardware configuration ?

    Maybe we can find something that link our problem...

    Thanks a lot,

    Luca M.

     
  • 2011年4月4日 下午 02:47
     
     
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    One more note, before we discovered the issue we tested the server with JamSoft Heavy-load for 36 hours and had no issues.
    However looking back, I now realize the IO was all local and we did not test the NIC's IO except for Web Browsing.

    Thanks - John Webster

     
  • 2011年4月4日 下午 08:34
     
     
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    This is a long shot but have you tried to disable IPv6 on all NIC cards?
     
  • 2011年4月4日 下午 08:38
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    Something to test:

    Can you test the performance of the network adapters when Hyper-V is installed - but the network adapters are not configured for a virtual network? (this will help me to figure out where we should be looking)

    Cheers,
    Benjamin Armstrong
    ============================
    Windows Virtualization
    Senior Lead Program Manager

    This posting is provided AS IS with no warranties, and confers no rights. You assume all risk for your use.
     
  • 2011年4月5日 下午 02:01
     
     
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    BIOS virtualization options sounds to be the cause of the issue.

     

    It's not only NIC as you see CPU overload and IO going down (local copy).

     

    Could be a good test to switch off BIOS options see the results...

     

    Downgrade to a previous BIOS version (stable and working with Hyper-V) test again.

     

    Then if you find the cause, get in touch with the constructor.

     

    Good luck!

     

    Regards, Yannick.

     
  • 2011年4月5日 下午 02:02
     
     
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    Specialy if you confirm that the issue start even with VM off.

     

     

     
  • 2011年4月5日 下午 04:50
     
     
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    Dear Ben and Yannic,

    the issue start even with Vm off and even without any VM .

    I've tried various combination of bios settings, but performances still remain slow.

    Tried different BIOS version, too.

    Two hours ago I've installed VMWARE ESXI and it runs perfectly at full speed... so now I think it's not a BIOS-related problem.

    What to say... I will use VWMARE again until hyper-v performance will be acceptable !

    But in someone has some new idea or something I'll try it !

    Thanks to everybody.

    Luca M.

     
  • 2011年4月5日 下午 06:01
     
     
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    Luca,

    I may not be able to get the detailed hardaware configuation.
    But, I have summary below.
    We have sent the server back to the vendor to be diagnosed.
    They may just provide us a replacement.  I will post any results that they find.

    Thanks - John Webster

    Server Info:
    =========
    CPU Intel  E5620 x 2
    48GB RAM
    Server Board:  S5520HCR
    http://ark.intel.com/Product.aspx?id=36599  
     Disk Controler Adaptec 5405  ( 600GB  x 4  15K SAS RAID 10)
    http://www.adaptec.com/en-us/support/raid/sas_raid/sas-5405/
    OnBoard RAID (2TB x 2 WD RE4 SATA RAID1)
    Intel 4 Port Server NIC (I do not have part number right now)


     
  • 2011年4月6日 上午 10:44
     
     
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    Hi Crivella,

    Even I am facing this kind of issue but I am using Hyper-V with Clustering on SAN.
    Please clarify if u can
    1) R u using any clustering for VM's on Hyper-V.
    2) How do you access NAS box on Hyper-V?


    Thanks & Regards
    Anand S

     

    Thanks & Regards Anand Sunka MCSA+CCNA+MCTS
     
  • 2011年4月6日 下午 01:35
     
     
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    He said that just adding the role Hyper-v server start the problem.

     

    No VM, no Cluster, no NAS... Just having the service.

     

    Yannick

     
  • 2011年5月19日 上午 03:00
     
     
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    Did you ever figure out the solution to this problem? (windows 2008 r2 host server slows down dramatically when hyper-v role is installed, even with no VMs running)

    I'm experiencing the same thing, even with a "virgin" install of win2008r2 (no non-MS drivers, no patches).

    tried with and without patches, tried disabling tcp offload.

    as soon as i remove hyper-v role performance goes back to normal.

     

    p.s. also experiencing very slow performance on host with hyper-v 2008r2-sp1 server (the free command-line only version).

     

     
  • 2011年6月21日 下午 08:52
     
     
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    We have the same problem in our environment (Windows 2008R2 Enterprise, intel 5520 server, 4x intel nic). We can reproduce the "slowness" only after creating a virtual network. only installing the hyper-v role gives no problems, only after creating a virtual network the "slowness" comes.

     

    windows 2008r2 enterprise sp1, intel driver 16.3 or microsoft driver (same issue)

     

    regards

    Armin Sattler

     
  • 2011年7月5日 下午 10:07
     
     
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    Don't know if this thread is dead, but I am having a simular issue. My CPU is fine but but network is SLOOOOOW. Did the TCPIP offload work around with no change. Win 2008R2 SP1 new VM on top of CORE host. On a Lenovo RD240

     
  • 2011年7月8日 上午 07:12
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    Have you installed KB2263829 on your Hyper-V?
     
  • 2011年8月30日 下午 10:14
     
     
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    I would like to throw my hat in the ring for this issue as well.  I see a reocurring theme, it appears most of us are using Intel Motherboards and Intel NIC's in combination with Hyper-V.

    The symptom is the servers disk IO drops to 25% and the system slows to a crawl after installing the Hyper-V role.  Uninstalling the Role results in the system going back to fast speeds.

    I've installed the latest NIC Drivers for intel (currently 16.5) and updating bios and all drivers, chipset, etc.

    I have replicated this on 3 servers, all Intel Chassis, Intel Mobo's, Adaptec RAID controllers, and Intel On-board NIC's.

    Is there anyone out there that can help?

    Yes, TCP Offloading is off on all NIC's

    No there is no Graphics card

    Yes KB2263829 is installed


     
  • 2011年8月30日 下午 11:38
     
     
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    Have you tried disabling TCP offloading? That's a common issue with network throughput

     

    Explicit Intel NIC mention: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/winserverhyperv/thread/bdc40358-45c8-4c4b-883b-a695f382e01a

    Other offloading/slow network threads

    http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/winserverhyperv/thread/133547e6-95c4-4596-bff9-3099000c2078

    http://social.technet.microsoft.com/Forums/en-US/winservercore/thread/d0c55df9-a27c-4876-bc5a-8ac7f1b46462

    http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/ff571012.aspx

     

     

     
  • 2011年8月31日 下午 02:06
     
     
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    Yes, I specifically turned off EVERYTHING to do with offloading on all the NIC's, this makes no difference.  I've attached images so you know I'm telling the truth, for reference sake there are no VM's yet, this is a fresh load of Windows, and there is NO Virtual Network.

    If I run HD Tune before installing the Hyper-V Role, I get about 350MB/s on my Adaptec RAID 5 Array with 6 Drives.

    After Installing Hyper-V Role I get 60MB/s on the same RAID, and the system just slows to a crawl.  I can replicate it.

     

     
  • 2011年9月20日 上午 11:40
     
     
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    I've had this same problem with a PowerEdge R910. As soon as Hyper-V is installed, disk copy performance drops to 10-20% of what it was prior to the installation.

    I've found a workaround that resolves the problem for me. Our R910 has 4 x Intel e7-8867l processor. If I disable the C states option within the processor settings of the BIOS, the copy speed returns to pre-Hyper-V installation speeds.

    I have a support incident raised with Microsoft and will be requesting a fix for this issue that doesn't include disabling the C States functionality.

     
  • 2011年12月20日 上午 11:41
     
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    I faced the same problem and it was solved by disabling Ethernet@WireSpeed option for the physical NIC mapped to this VM

    • 已提議為解答 lepach8 2013年2月1日 下午 05:31
    •  
     
  • 2012年1月4日 下午 05:02
     
     
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    Add me to this un-resolved issue. Though, my issue is only with the VMs themselves. The Host gets 92 MB/s (gigabit network) through its file shares. Latest BIOS, nic drivers, two Intel nics. W2K8R2 SP1 One NIC is dedicated to HOST only. The other NIC is dedicated to the Hyper-V Virtual Network. Per this thread, I've attempted to disable the TCP Checksum values. THat had no affect with the xfers from the VMs. I also read in this thread where I could have a 2nd virtual "private" network between the host and VMs for internal transfers from host to VMs. I'll do that during the next maintenance window, as that is a good idea. But, that doesn't resolve the issue at hand here.

    I faced the same problem and it was solved by disabling Ethernet@WireSpeed option for the physical NIC mapped to this VM

    That seems to be a Broadcom-only setting (per Bing searching) as I don't see anything like that with my Intel NICs.
    http://eduncan911.com
    • 已編輯 eduncan911.com 2012年1月4日 下午 05:04 formatting all messed up
    • 已提議為解答 AlexPT 2012年1月15日 下午 07:48
    • 已取消提議為解答 AlexPT 2012年1月15日 下午 07:48
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  • 2012年1月15日 下午 07:55
     
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    Hi,  I fixed the issue, today, by updating to Intel's 15th Dec 2011 version of the Intel NIC drivers.  Host was a Dell R610 with Broadcom (updated) and Intel Gigabit ET NICs.  The host ran like a pig and it took me hours just to get remote management working let alone anything else.  I digress.  So if you must use Hyper-V and have these Intel NICs make sure you use these new drivers -

     

    File name:
    PROWinx64.exe
    Version:
    16.8
    Date:
    12/15/2011
    Status:
    Latest
    Size:
    30.78 MB
    Language:
    English
    Operating Systems:
    Windows Web Server 2008 R2*, Windows Server 2008 R2 Enterprise*, Windows Server 2008 R2 for Datacenter*, Windows Server 2008 R2 Foundation*, Windows Server 2008 R2 Standard*

    • 已編輯 AlexPT 2012年1月15日 下午 07:56 wrong date entered initially
    • 已提議為解答 AlexPT 2012年1月15日 下午 07:56
    •  
     
  • 2012年1月25日 下午 11:24
     
     
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    Clearing the checksum fixed it for me
     
  • 2012年2月15日 下午 06:07
     
     
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    Same experience for me too. I just applied those registry settings to my recent hyper-v core and now I'm seeing better connections too.

    I used this article here and it seems much better now. crossing fingers.

    http://gavinmckay.wordpress.com/2011/03/12/windows-server-2008-r2-hyper-v-guests-lose-network-connectivity-temporarily/

     
  • 2012年4月26日 上午 08:33
     
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    Dear all,

    I have a big problem with my hyper-v server and network card. I've found a lot of topic around this question but none of them helped me.

    I have a Win 2008 R2 Server with only Hyper-V installed. I have 3 NIC , one is reserved to the host management and the others two are reserved for virtual machine .

    All NIC are Intel, one is integrated on the Intel motherboard and the others are Intel Gigabit ET Dual port .

    Before installing the role of Hyper-V all NIC worked perfectly with speed around 1Gb (file transfer average 90 MB/Sec, of course I have a Gigabit LAN) .

    After Hyper-V install, the host system  is going very slow and the network file transfer using the dedicated NIC is about ten time slower (9-10MB /sec) . Same problem with all VM off and also if I remove all VM !

    I tried all of suggestion found in old post (disabling TCP checksum / offload ...) but nothing happens.

    What is really strange is that by removing all network card all the Host operating system seems to improve the speed... but, of course, I can't use  my LAN :(

    I need help because every night I must make a full backup of Virtual hard disk from the host to a backup server in my lan.

    My configuration:

    - Server Win 2008 R2 SP1 with Hyper-V and no others role

    - 2 Virtual Machine (one Win 2008 R2 and one Win 7 Ultimate)

    - NAS Linux (access via SMB with no problem)

    - Various Windows 7 Pro client

    Thanks in advance to everybody,

    Luca M.

    Hello,

    maybe I have the solution for this problem. I Have the following configuration:

    Intel 5520HC Mainboard

    Windows Server 2008 R2 Enterprise with HyperV Role SP1

    >32 GB Memory

    I have extremly slow performance (VGA, LAN, HD(!!!))

    Then I found the following article:

    http://www.thomas-krenn.com/de/wiki/Schlechte_LAN_und_I/O_Performance_mit_Microsoft_Hyper-V_auf_Intel_Systemen_mit_mehr_als_32_GByte_RAM

    This solve my problem complete!

    Mfg

    Björn

    Mfg Björn Reichard

    • 已提議為解答 BReichard 2012年4月26日 上午 08:33
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  • 2012年4月27日 下午 11:02
     
     
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    This issue still seems to be plaguing as we are having the same issue on multiple client sites.
     
  • 2012年4月28日 上午 04:57
     
     
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    Try http://support.microsoft.com/kb/2517329 , disabling C states, or both.

     
  • 2012年8月8日 上午 05:58
     
     
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    in Dell PE810 disable these solve above problem

    BIOS/Processor Settings
    C1E Disable
    C States Disable

     
  • 2012年12月16日 下午 08:39
     
     
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    I had situation (which is why I found this thread) where I would get reasonable speeds in all directions and between hosts, except in one case.  From an i5-2500 workstation to an AMD FX-6100 hyper-v host local share the transfer rate was a ridiculous 30KB/s.  From hyper-v to the workstation it was about 70MB/s.  Humorously, or so it seemed, I had a Windows 8 VMware VM on the same i5 workstation and its transfer rate to the hyper-v was in a reasonable MB/s range.  

    In short, I isolated the issue to IPv6 on the workstation.  Once I disabled IPv6, the transfer speed to hyper-v went up to the MB/s. 

    No other server (2003 or 2008 or various NAS) had an issue with the workstation (nor with hyper-v, either way), only hyper-v had an issue with the workstation and only when transferring to a hyper-v share (which made vm conversions I was doing from esxi to hyper-v impossibly slow).  Why disabling IPv6 makes a difference I've not figured out, but for now I can continue with my evaluation of hyper-v.

    Hope this helps someone else.

    Bruce

     
  • 2013年1月9日 上午 03:22
     
     
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    I had this problem with a Dell PE R320 and the Broadcom Gigabit nic's.  I found that by having one for Hyper V Virtual Network only, no management, and the other dedicated to the host, that the host would work fine and that the VM would still be slow.  I disabled ALL the offloading and that still had no effect.  I jacked around with all the settings for the adapter on the host then and found additionally that disabling Virtual Machine Queues on the adapter on the host finally solved my problem.
    • 已提議為解答 HSSBrian 2013年1月29日 上午 02:07
    • 已取消提議為解答 HSSBrian 2013年1月29日 上午 02:07
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  • 2013年1月29日 上午 02:00
     
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    Thank you JuiceJug1016! I'm an IT consultant and Dell reseller and have two customers using Dell PE T320 servers and I couldn't figure out why the one customer was having such weird ping times. The first customer with the same configured unit was fine. The second, getting ready for the production environment was suffering terribly with slow network ping times and file transfer. After checking the network configuration I discovered the "Virtual Machine Queues" was turned on for the second customer. Soon as I turned it off everything was cool.


    • 已編輯 HSSBrian 2013年1月29日 上午 02:04
    • 已提議為解答 Steve JainMVP 2013年3月22日 下午 10:32
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  • 2013年2月12日 下午 05:19
     
     
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    Thanks JuiceJug1016! exactly the same issue host machine windows 2012 PE T320 host network browsing speeds fine any guest machines has 315KB sec copy speeds spent weeks playing with virtual switch setup nic teaming etc and as soon as I disabled Virtual Machine Queues on the host adapter my vm's were using my speed returned to normal speed.
     
  • 2013年2月17日 上午 02:34
     
     
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     Thanks juicejug1016! I have a PE420, this tip was a life safer... 8-)
     
  • 2013年2月25日 下午 02:50
     
     
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    Thanks juicejug1016.  I'm running Windows Server 2012 Hyper-V on a Poweredge R720 (A Dell build on it too!) and found that disabling just the "Virtual Machine Queues" on the host's Broadcom cards fixed the slow networking on the guest OS's immediately.  

    Many thanks

     
  • 2013年3月18日 下午 04:12
     
     
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    Genius.  I wish I had found your post 5 days ago.

    Mike F

     
  • 2013年3月22日 下午 09:31
     
     
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    Amazing answer. I spent a huge amount of grief trying to fix this same problem and stumbled upon this answer. This fix worked and I am grateful.
     
  • 2013年3月23日 上午 12:18
     
     
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    not sure what the problem is as I have several disparate servers and the LAN runs fine for the bare hypervisor and the virtual machines

    if performance is a problem 10GBASE-T gear is available and prices are coming down

    40GBASE-T is still expensive

    100GBASE-T is even more esoteric

    make sure your cabling is up to par, cat 7a is the choice to use today

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  • 2013年4月10日 下午 12:40
     
     
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    I seem to be having very similar performance issues with a freshly built Dell R720xd running the Hyper-V 2012 server. The hypervisor only. That being the case, I can't seem to find my may through the RSAT to find the NIC properties pages shown above to disable the "virtual machine queues". Any ideas?

    Sheldon

     
  • 2013年4月10日 下午 12:41
     
     
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    I had this problem with a Dell PE R320 and the Broadcom Gigabit nic's.  I found that by having one for Hyper V Virtual Network only, no management, and the other dedicated to the host, that the host would work fine and that the VM would still be slow.  I disabled ALL the offloading and that still had no effect.  I jacked around with all the settings for the adapter on the host then and found additionally that disabling Virtual Machine Queues on the adapter on the host finally solved my problem.

    How would I go about locating these settings in the Hypervisor 2012 only install using RSAT? Thoughts?
     
  • 2013年4月10日 下午 12:47
     
     
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    RSAT is usually run from the administrator's desk on a Windows 8 machine.

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  • 2013年4月10日 下午 01:17
     
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    I had this problem with a Dell PE R320 and the Broadcom Gigabit nic's.  I found that by having one for Hyper V Virtual Network only, no management, and the other dedicated to the host, that the host would work fine and that the VM would still be slow.  I disabled ALL the offloading and that still had no effect.  I jacked around with all the settings for the adapter on the host then and found additionally that disabling Virtual Machine Queues on the adapter on the host finally solved my problem.

    How would I go about locating these settings in the Hypervisor 2012 only install using RSAT? Thoughts?

    With Get-NetAdapterAdvancedProperty. Simple usage:

    Get-NetAdapterAdvancedProperty -Name "Ethernet 2"

    All physical adapters:

    Get-NetAdapter -Physical | Get-NetAdapterAdvancedProperty

    The issue is that not all vendors name the property the same way, and some NICs don't support it at all. You can sometimes pull things like:

    Get-NetAdapter -Physical | Get-NetAdapterAdvancedProperty | Where-Object "DisplayName" -Like "*queue*"

    To change it:

    Get-NetAdapter "Ethernet 3" | Get-NetAdapterAdvancedProperty -DisplayName "Virtual Machine Queues" | Set-NetAdapterAdvancedProperty -DisplayValue "Disabled"

    Make sure you use the display name for your adapter and the same sort of language for DisplayValue that it uses. Instead of DisplayValue, you can also use -RegistryValue 0.

    You can also open up regedit on your Hyper-V Server and dig through the subkeys of HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Control\Class\{4d36e972-e325-11ce-bfc1-08002be10318} and change them that way. That's all the above PowerShell commands do. You can find the allowable settings under the adapter's subkey \Ndi\params\<fieldname>\Enum.

    I've also found that if your adapters don't support VMQ at all and you're using teaming in 2012 to host a virtual switch, it sometimes help if you disable VMQ on the virtual adapter that hosts your virtual switch.

    Eric Siron
    http://www.altaro.com/hyper-v/


    • 已編輯 Eric Siron 2013年4月10日 下午 02:06
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