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Replacing SBS 2011 server RRS feed

  • Question

  • Our SBS 2011 server is about 7 years old now, so it's time to shop for a new machine. And that's a good opportunity to update Windows Server as well. Unfortunately, there's no SBS anymore. I'm not willing to put everything in the cloud, as Microsoft expects small companies to do. I like to have control over my own stuff, so what are my options? Server Essentials 2016 seems to be the choice for small companies, but it relies more or less on Azure. And Exchange won't run on it, as I understand.

    What we need is a server for file/printservices, Windows Update and Exchange. Sharepoint or SQL server have never been used and I don't think they ever will.

    So I'm curious what you people use as a replacement for SBS?



    Simon Weel

    Wednesday, January 10, 2018 10:29 AM

Answers


  • Now, what to use to replace Exchange? There's a whole bunch of Exchange-alikes; visited some comparison sites but it's not easy to make a choice. Any recommendations?

    To properly close this topic - we've replaced the SBS machine with a new one running Hyper-V core 2016. This hosts two Server 2016 VM's. One for Domain Services / file / printserver and one for Exchange 2016. I investigated the most frequently used Exchange-alternatives, but simply put: they don't offer all Exchange features. At least, not the ones we use. Everything runs fine for about 6 months now, so we're happy with this setup. BTW - we don't use the Essentials role and nobody seems to miss it...


    Simon Weel

    Wednesday, December 11, 2019 10:58 AM
  • Hi,

    Windows Server Essentials has replaced SBS and it is the later/newer OS version for SBS. in general, for small business network, we would recommend Windows Server Essentials, as it not only has the functions which are included in SBS(such as client computer manage, RWA, media streaming), it also has new and improved functions(such as online service integration).

    At the same time, not same as SBS, Exchange, SQL and SharePoint are no longer included within Essentials.

    Windows Server Essentials provides below mail deployment options:
    1. On-premises Exchange Server.
    2. Office 365(online exchange).
    3. Third-party hosted email services.

    Based on your description, you want to use local Exchange Server – option 1. If you also want to keep SBS/Essentials specific functions, you can consider of below 2 deployments:
    1. Windows Server Essentials + Windows Server Standard/Datacenter(2 physical devices):
    Essentials is configured as DC, another server is a member server and it is used to holds Exchange Server.

    2. Windows Server Standard(1 physical device and 2 virtual instances):
    Standard OS version supports 2 virtual instances. So, one Standard OS installed on physical device, and configured it has Hyper-V host.
    2 Standard OS are Hyper-V guests, one is configured with Essentials Experience role and configured as DC, another one is configured as member server and holds Exchange Server.

    If you do not want to keep SBS/Essentials specific functions, I would recommend you to consider of Standard OS version, as mentioned above, holds 2 virtual instances, one for AD DS, and one for member server and holds Exchange Server.

    Note, Exchange is not recommended to be installed on DC, and this it is the prerequisite for above suggestion.

    Also, blog “Email Options Supported by Windows Server 2012 Essentials” can be considered as a reference:
    https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/sbs/2012/07/26/email-options-supported-by-windows-server-2012-essentials/

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Thursday, January 11, 2018 6:13 AM
    Moderator

All replies

  • Hi,

    Windows Server Essentials has replaced SBS and it is the later/newer OS version for SBS. in general, for small business network, we would recommend Windows Server Essentials, as it not only has the functions which are included in SBS(such as client computer manage, RWA, media streaming), it also has new and improved functions(such as online service integration).

    At the same time, not same as SBS, Exchange, SQL and SharePoint are no longer included within Essentials.

    Windows Server Essentials provides below mail deployment options:
    1. On-premises Exchange Server.
    2. Office 365(online exchange).
    3. Third-party hosted email services.

    Based on your description, you want to use local Exchange Server – option 1. If you also want to keep SBS/Essentials specific functions, you can consider of below 2 deployments:
    1. Windows Server Essentials + Windows Server Standard/Datacenter(2 physical devices):
    Essentials is configured as DC, another server is a member server and it is used to holds Exchange Server.

    2. Windows Server Standard(1 physical device and 2 virtual instances):
    Standard OS version supports 2 virtual instances. So, one Standard OS installed on physical device, and configured it has Hyper-V host.
    2 Standard OS are Hyper-V guests, one is configured with Essentials Experience role and configured as DC, another one is configured as member server and holds Exchange Server.

    If you do not want to keep SBS/Essentials specific functions, I would recommend you to consider of Standard OS version, as mentioned above, holds 2 virtual instances, one for AD DS, and one for member server and holds Exchange Server.

    Note, Exchange is not recommended to be installed on DC, and this it is the prerequisite for above suggestion.

    Also, blog “Email Options Supported by Windows Server 2012 Essentials” can be considered as a reference:
    https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/sbs/2012/07/26/email-options-supported-by-windows-server-2012-essentials/

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Thursday, January 11, 2018 6:13 AM
    Moderator
  • I would suggest an on prem server, 2016 Standard running Hyper-V (virtualised DC and F&P).

    Put Exchange on Office 365.


    Robert Pearman Cloud & Datacentre MVP
    @titlerequired | LinkedIn | Google+
    Facebook | Windows Server Essentials.com

    Friday, January 12, 2018 9:13 AM
    Moderator
  • Hi,

    How things are going there on this issue?

    Please let me know if you would like further assistance.

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Monday, January 15, 2018 2:52 AM
    Moderator
  • How things are going there on this issue?
    If I get it right, the Windows Standard server doesn't contain the functionality offered by Essentials?

    Simon Weel

    Monday, January 15, 2018 7:52 AM
  • Hi,

    Windows Server 2012/2012 R/2016 Standard includes a server role named Windows Server Essentials Experience Role, it provides you the same functions as Windows Server Essentials.

    Main difference between them are CALs, Essentials specific limitation.

    Windows Server Essentials Experience Overview:
    https://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/library/dn280940(v=ws.11).aspx

    Differences Between Windows Server Essentials And The Windows Server Essentials Experience Role:
    https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/ausoemteam/2015/06/25/differences-between-windows-server-essentials-and-the-windows-server-essentials-experience-role/

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Monday, January 15, 2018 8:46 AM
    Moderator
  • Main difference between them are CALs, Essentials specific limitation.

    Right, so I thought things where pretty clear, but.... For Essentials I don't need CAL's - they are included. But if I setup a second Standard server to host Exchange, don't I need CAL's for that machine? And if so, there's no longer a reason to setup an Essentials server, since the same thing Essentials has to offer can be added to the Standard server by means of the Essentials Experience.

    And how about the two-server-scenario? For SBS, you could install an additional server with the Premium Add-on. To me, that made sense- with two servers there's some sort of redundancy if one server fails. But I recall the experts advising against a two-server solution as it would (over)complicate things. Doesn't the same apply to a setup of both an Essentials and Standard server (whether virtual or not)?


    Simon Weel

    Monday, January 15, 2018 9:45 AM
  • I would suggest if you are concerned about over complication of two servers, Exchange Online solves that issue.

    A single physical server, running 2 Virtual Servers, one Domain Controller and a second, either running Essentials Experience (or not) supplying file & print services is perfect for small business.


    Robert Pearman Cloud & Datacentre MVP
    @titlerequired | LinkedIn | Google+
    Facebook | Windows Server Essentials.com

    Monday, January 15, 2018 1:02 PM
    Moderator
  • Hi,

    >But if I setup a second Standard server to host Exchange, don't I need CAL's for that machine?
    CAL should be purchased additionally for another member server.

    >Doesn't the same apply to a setup of both an Essentials and Standard server (whether virtual or not)?
    It is not same for Essentials as there is no “Premium Add-on” for Essentials. The server licensing rights have been expanded, allowing you to install an instance of Essentials on your physical server to run the Hyper-V role (with none of the other roles and features of the Essentials Experience installed), and a second instance of Essentials as a virtual machine (VM) on that same server with all the Essentials Experience roles and features.

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Tuesday, January 16, 2018 1:53 AM
    Moderator
  • I would suggest if you are concerned about over complication of two servers, Exchange Online solves that issue.

    I'm not that concerned about two servers, but I recall from the SBS-days it was discouraged to do so. It's more like I wonder what has changed since then to actually recommend a multi-server setup?

    Simon Weel

    Tuesday, January 16, 2018 11:41 AM
  • >But if I setup a second Standard server to host Exchange, don't I need CAL's for that machine?
    CAL should be purchased additionally for another member server.

    Oh boy, I did some reading about licensing, only to discover it's a pool of troubled water. We have more devices as we have users (about 15), so User CAL's are probably the best choice. Let's draw a couple of scenarios.

    a) I setup one physical Essentials server and one physical Standard server with Exchange. The Exchange server is used solely for Exchange AND Fileservices. The Essentials server takes care of all other roles like AD, Printservices etc. How many User CAL's do I need for this?

    b) I setup a single physical server to hold two virtual servers; one Essentials server and one Standard server with Exchange. The Exchange server is used solely for Exchange. The Essentials server takes care of all other roles like AD, Fileservices, Printservices etc. How many User CAL's do I need for this setup?

     Or are there any other licensing methods to make it easy?


    Simon Weel

    Tuesday, January 16, 2018 11:51 AM
  • a)essentials sku includes cals so 0 for that.

    15 exchange cals.

    the second server is a question i cant remember the answer to, i have a feeling the Essentials CALs did not cover use of the second server for file & print, so you would also need 15 server cals. 

    b) 15 server cals and 15 exchange cals

    Rough Pricing

    Windows Server : £800

    Windows Server CAL : £44

    Exchange Server : £470

    Exchange Server CAL : £90

    Windows Server Essentials £480


    Robert Pearman Cloud & Datacentre MVP
    @titlerequired | LinkedIn | Google+
    Facebook | Windows Server Essentials.com


    Tuesday, January 16, 2018 12:26 PM
    Moderator
  • You will need Windows User CALs for the second server, along with an Exchange Server license and User CALs.

    Steven Banks [WSSMB MVP] Banks Consulting Northwest Inc. http://www.banksnw.com Puget Sound Small Business Server User Group http://www.pssbs.org

    Tuesday, January 16, 2018 1:07 PM
    Moderator
  • Hi,

    How things are going there on this issue?

    Please let me know if you would like further assistance.

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Thursday, January 18, 2018 7:34 AM
    Moderator
  • Did some more research, obtained some quotes and based on that made a couple of proposals for the management. One in which we host Exchange on-premisse, with both Essentials and Server Standard and one proposal in which we switch to Office 365 Business and put Exchange in the cloud. Then we only need a single Essentials server.

    But no matter what solution; it's expensive. In 2011 we bought SBS 2011 +15 additional CAL's for less than 1000 euro. With Exchange on-site, we pay 900 euro for Server Standard without CAL's, Essentials is 510 euro and Exchange with 20 CAL's is about 2500 euro. Triple the cost of SBS.

    Office 365 Business Premium for 20 users is about 2500 euro / year. The advantage being less maintenance.

    Now the management has to make a decision, which probably will take some time.....


    Simon Weel

    Thursday, January 18, 2018 8:20 AM
  • Hi,

    Thank you for taking the time to have an detail update about the result.

    In general, for Windows Server Essentials, below are recommended solutions if you want to use mail services:
    1. Windows Server Essentials SKU + Office 365/Exchange Online. –> 25 users and 50 devices limitation.
    2. Windows Server Standard (2 virtual machines) + local Exchange Server. –> 75 users and devices for WS2012/2012 r2. 500 users and devices for WS2016.

    Support for larger deployments – only applied to WS2016:
    https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-server-essentials/get-started/support-for-larger-deployments

    You can contact Microsoft Sales/Customer Service, consult detail price for each deployment. And choose the one which meets your requirement.

    Besides, if any of above reply is helpful, please click “Mark as answer” if the reply is helpful. It would make this reply to the top and easier to be found for other people who has the similar problem.

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Thursday, January 18, 2018 8:32 AM
    Moderator
  • Hi,

    Is there any update?

    Please click “Mark as answer” if the reply is helpful. It would make this reply to the top and easier to be found for other people who has the similar problem.

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Monday, January 22, 2018 3:50 AM
    Moderator
  • Hi,

    Any update?

    Best Regards,
    Eve Wang

    Please remember to mark the replies as answers if they help.
    If you have feedback for TechNet Subscriber Support, contact tnmff@microsoft.com.

    Wednesday, January 24, 2018 1:49 AM
    Moderator
  • Just thank the stars you aren't using SBS Premium with SQLServer.  That's when the painful pricing really begins...

    I'll be dealing with this in a year or so when SBS2011 is going off support (by 2020) so interested what you end up doing.


    -- Al


    • Edited by AMBW Wednesday, January 24, 2018 10:31 PM
    Wednesday, January 24, 2018 10:31 PM
  • Just thank the stars you aren't using SBS Premium with SQLServer.  That's 

    As a matter of fact - we do. SQL Server is needed for the accounting software we use. But right now we are moving to a cloud solution for the accounting stuff, so we can ditch SQL Server once the transition finishes.


    Simon Weel

    Thursday, January 25, 2018 8:02 AM
  • Me 2.

    I might be going from 3 servers to 4. $$$$$

    I think that I can virtualize 2 of them though

    Allan

    Thursday, January 25, 2018 5:09 PM
  • Well, we still haven't replaced our SBS server. And we decided to host our own mailserver. That won't be Exchange, since the latest version is clearly not aimed at the SMB community. With Windows server 2019 on the block, it seems logical to use that version. There is a 2019-essentials as well, but it lacks RWW, so I don't think it will be of any use? We probably will get the Standard version.

    Now, what to use to replace Exchange? There's a whole bunch of Exchange-alikes; visited some comparison sites but it's not easy to make a choice. Any recommendations?


    Simon Weel

    Wednesday, January 2, 2019 4:27 PM
  • So those folks that have invested countless hours/years into developing a dynamic company webs on a SBS machine, YOu know because when MS promoted SBS it was the latest and greatest thing everyone just had to have and it was going to be around forever, that's what we were told.  Now that we're all entrenched in the SBS and invested, here is MS again pulling the rugs out of beneths admins feet. What's replacing company web then, to bad?  IS MS prepare to recover all that last time for us, doubt it?  Would take me 10 years to re-develop everything on our co-web but with nothing to develop it on.  Love how MS puts real thought into the practical things admins face everyday.  Save the canned response.
    Tuesday, December 10, 2019 4:25 PM

  • Now, what to use to replace Exchange? There's a whole bunch of Exchange-alikes; visited some comparison sites but it's not easy to make a choice. Any recommendations?

    To properly close this topic - we've replaced the SBS machine with a new one running Hyper-V core 2016. This hosts two Server 2016 VM's. One for Domain Services / file / printserver and one for Exchange 2016. I investigated the most frequently used Exchange-alternatives, but simply put: they don't offer all Exchange features. At least, not the ones we use. Everything runs fine for about 6 months now, so we're happy with this setup. BTW - we don't use the Essentials role and nobody seems to miss it...


    Simon Weel

    Wednesday, December 11, 2019 10:58 AM