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Editing Wiki adds extra breaks every time I save the article RRS feed

  • Question


  • I’ve been working on the article below and I’ve noticed that every time I save the article it adds extra breaks.  I’m not an HTML guy so if it looks horrible in the HTML view let me know.  If I’m doing something wrong, let me know.  Tips, tricks, oh hey by the ways… All ears!  Also, and links to information about adding screen shots would be helpful for another article I’m working on.

    http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/20964.active-directory-ultimate-reading-collection.aspx

    Any help would be appreciated!  Thanks in advance!

     



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    Thursday, December 12, 2013 5:38 AM

Answers

  • I fixed the article you linked. We think it might be IE 10 and IE 11, but I don't seem to have problems with IE9. When I get a chance I will experiment with IE 11 and FireFox in a test Wiki I have. Also, it might be related to the unordered lists in the article. All of the extra breaks in your article were after the last entry of an unordered list. I want to test and track the problem down as much as possible so we can report it to the developers to be fixed.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services

    • Marked as answer by Kelly Bush Sunday, December 15, 2013 7:55 PM
    Friday, December 13, 2013 3:39 AM
    Moderator

All replies

  • I have heard this problem reported, but have not experienced it myself. It is a recent bug. It is said to only happen in IE (perhaps IE10 or IE11), so you might try another browser until this bug is fixed. I believe the issue has been reported to the developers.

    In the meantime, I will work on the HTML of the article myself.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services


    Thursday, December 12, 2013 11:17 PM
    Moderator
  • I've used both FF and IE and they have the same issue, it's weird.  Also, on my other article it's fine and when I put my name in on the December Guru article it was fine there too.  It just seems to be this one.  I'll maybe try Crome and see what happens with it.  Thanks for the help in advance Richard!

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    Thursday, December 12, 2013 11:31 PM
  • I fixed the article you linked. We think it might be IE 10 and IE 11, but I don't seem to have problems with IE9. When I get a chance I will experiment with IE 11 and FireFox in a test Wiki I have. Also, it might be related to the unordered lists in the article. All of the extra breaks in your article were after the last entry of an unordered list. I want to test and track the problem down as much as possible so we can report it to the developers to be fixed.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services

    • Marked as answer by Kelly Bush Sunday, December 15, 2013 7:55 PM
    Friday, December 13, 2013 3:39 AM
    Moderator
  • So far I have been unable to duplicate the problem myself. I tested in IE 9, IE 11, and Firefox. I wonder if the bug has been fixed.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services

    Friday, December 13, 2013 5:19 PM
    Moderator
  • So I tested adding links via IE8 and IE 11 today and it seems to work fine.  I think you're absolutely correct about the mess I had with the extra breaks.  After you cleaned it up for me it seems to be working as it should now.  Thanks for the help!  Still just trying to figure out how to use the editor!

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    Sunday, December 15, 2013 7:55 PM
  • I am using IE11 and I was hoping to author a series of TechNet Wiki pages and I will not be able to do that based on my current experiences. The extra spacing problem happens every time I save my first article (apart from first publish). I have experienced problems saving and basic features like inserting an image do not save the last browse folder.

    It will be hard to justify spending time publishing articles if most of the time is spent fighting with the in-built editor and layout problems and not on the actual content.

    Any Wiki Ninja tips to make the whole experience more productive? It would be a shame not to be able to share content here.

    [edit] To be more direct, does anybody use a more efficient workflow, prepare articles in [X], to supplement working in the in-built Wiki editor? I will plagiarize style and layout from some articles highlighted as outstanding examples. 

    [edit] here is an article with the problem: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/21999.lightswitch-screen-templates-in-vs2013.aspx

    Dave


    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.




    • Edited by Xpert360 Monday, December 16, 2013 3:31 PM
    Monday, December 16, 2013 12:57 PM
  • Dave,

    I removed extra line breaks (<br> tags) in the HTML of the article you referenced. I also added a language tag.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services

    Monday, December 16, 2013 3:51 PM
    Moderator
  • Thanks Richard,

    Is it worth trying to diagnose IE11 - Wiki editor problems before going further? Don't mind being a Guinea pig.

    Cheers

    Dave


    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.

    Monday, December 16, 2013 3:54 PM
  • I would be worth it. We (the community) track bugs, some specific to IE versions, then prioritize them and present to the developers (although they have a lot on their plate). But I was unable to duplicate the problem in IE 11 (on Windows RT 8.1), so perhaps I don't understand it.

    Are you saying that extra line breaks are added every time you save the article? Even if you save with no changes? I have not experienced that. Or is it only newly published articles, the first time you save? I have not done that lately.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services

    Monday, December 16, 2013 4:07 PM
    Moderator
  • Hi Richard,

    I just tried a quick edit and it has automatically inserted extra new lines again :(

    So I need a fix or I can't really do any Wiki work... :(

    Cheers

    Dave


    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.


    • Edited by Xpert360 Monday, December 16, 2013 4:14 PM
    Monday, December 16, 2013 4:12 PM
  • I just used the HTML editor rather than the Designer view and it just goes on adding < br >

    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.

    Monday, December 16, 2013 4:18 PM
  • That's what I had to do when mine was causing issues.  I'd save a copy of the code as a just in case and also make changes to the code offline and paste it back in.

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    Monday, December 16, 2013 4:26 PM
  • Hi Kelly,

    Mmm, IE 11 does that a little in this forum too (adds extra < br > in textareas).

    I thought about 'compatibility mode view' but it only lets me add 'microsoft.com' to that which surely is a (bad) joke.

    We have uncovered numerous bugs in Microsoft software from Win Azure/Identity (exciting hotfix applied last Friday) to VS2013 probs and spent considerable time diagnosing this lot in the last week with Msft.

    I think I can only spend another 30 minutes or so on this then I will have to give it up and just post the content on our company website. It has not been a good experience using Msft services at all this last month...

    [edit] I may ditch IE11 all together at this rate, it is poor!

    Dave


    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.


    • Edited by Xpert360 Monday, December 16, 2013 4:36 PM
    Monday, December 16, 2013 4:35 PM
  • OK, now I duplicated the problem. When I saved your article in IE 11, extra line breaks were added. I cannot yet tell what triggers it. It might be links to other sources, such as library articles (although I tried that in the past). Line breaks got added in more places when you saved than when I saved.

    In any case I will add this to our "Known Issues" and describe it as best I can. We expect an update to the Wiki platform in the next few weeks, maybe at the start of the year. Who knows what that will bring.

    At this time there is no workaround, other than to manually remove the extra <br> tags in the HTML view of the editor. I'm used to working in the HTML (sad to say), but most would be intimidated by it.

    I will save the article a few more times to make sure it is only IE 10 or above with the problem (and not Firefox, for example), then I will fix the article (until it is saved again).

    I case you want to try, where ever there is a line break, the HTML tab of the editor shows two <br> tags, one at the end of the line and another on the next line by itself. That results in one blank line between paragraphs or whatever. This bug addes two more <br> tags at these points every time you save. The fix is generally to remove an even number of <br> tags at these points, leaving just two. Then you can switch to the Design tab to confirm how the article looks. Of course, I have been fixing this in IE 9, which doesn't seem to experience the bug, so maybe this won't work in IE 11. I should fix the article this time in IE 11 to check. I will report back.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services

    Monday, December 16, 2013 4:38 PM
    Moderator
  • [deleted extra blank line LOL]

    When I edited the Wiki article in the HTML text editor (which sadly I am good at too) it looked ok but after saving it adds extra < br > in which it is impossible to avoid.

    With my comment on ditching IE11, I will give 'microsoft.com' in compatibility mode a go...


    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.

    Monday, December 16, 2013 4:45 PM
  • Oh great, that made it somewhat better.

    Using IE11 and editing the HTML, the browser does a friendly format of the HTML which means it displays the content with extra CR (or CR/LF) after it says a < br > . This makes editing the HTML nicer but destroys the layout.

    In compatibility mode the HTML is all scrunched-up not far from minified javascript.

    This is almost 2014 so we have reached this astounding level of web page design after 20 years. I swear it was better on IE4.2 in 1999. Lets party/code like its nineteen-ninety-nine!

    Thanks for helping people but I am going to throw the towel in. I will check again in January 2014. The state of things is so embarrassing, I just cannot believe it, but I can.

    IE11 + TechNet Wiki editor together do not even support HTML 3 standard let alone HTML 5 :(

    Dave


    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.



    • Edited by Xpert360 Monday, December 16, 2013 5:01 PM
    Monday, December 16, 2013 4:54 PM
  • Ok as a test in IE 11 I saved your wiki and got the same effect.  The difference with yours and mine was that when I save the HTML and pasted it back in, it would save it correctly.  Not the case with yours, it still just adds extra breaks.

    I agree that it's very annoying. 

    Seems like working in Firefox doesn't present the issue.  It's something about the breaks and IE 11.


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    Monday, December 16, 2013 5:09 PM
  • This gives me a lot of information to report in our "Known Issues" Wiki. I never use compatibility mode myself, because of past issues in the forums.

    I tested in my Test Wiki. No problem with IE 9 or Firefox (I don't have IE 10). The problem was originally reported December 13 in IE 10 and 11. At that time I could not duplicate (using my Test Wiki) in IE 9, Firefox, or IE 11.

    Today, using the same Test Wiki results in a disaster when I save in IE 11. The article is more than twice as long. It would take a lot of effort to fix (I would revert rather than fix). Also, the extra <br> tags were inserted when I edited in IE 11, before I even saved (which I think you confirm). My theory is that something changed December 13, but because it takes awhile for such changes to propogate to servers all over the world, I did not experience it then. Now I do (but only in IE 11). And the results are bad.

    The TechNet Wiki Community Council held an online meeting last week, and also the TechNet Wiki Advisory Board. At one of those meetings I think I remember Ed Price saying he has emailed our contact with the developers about this. I will check. I also will update our Wiki: Known Issues.

    The Known Issues Wiki is updated for this issue.


    Richard Mueller - MVP Directory Services


    Monday, December 16, 2013 5:20 PM
    Moderator
  • Viewing this forum and other bits of *microsoft.com in compatibility view IE11 has various layout issues, so I cannot really do that.

    If Msft TechNet team can roll out some form of useable HTML editor that works with IE11 (no doubt + patches) in the Jan 2014 timeframe I will give the TechNet Wiki more consideration.

    But for now, hats off to you people sticking to publishing stuff here in TechNet Wiki. Having stuck with IE from v3 through v11, it will be tragic if it is the really poor IE11 release that makes me ditch IE. Woeful!

    Thanks anyway

    Dave


    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.

    Monday, December 16, 2013 5:21 PM
  • Just an extra note, IE11 also breaks:

    Visual Studio Gallery editing

    So it is not just TechNet Wiki...

    Any update or further feedback?

    I have to use another browser for VS Gallery (Google Chrome at the moment). No response on Msft Connect entries, forums etc. after weeks on these and other issues (Surface PRO). Truly woeful.


    Dave Baker | AIDE for LightSwitch | Xpert360 blog | twitter : @xpert360 | Xpert360 website | Opinions are my own. For better forums, remember to mark posts as helpful/answer.

    Friday, January 10, 2014 9:21 AM
  • I've also got this problem, and I'd reckon it started around the time I installed IE10 on Win7. It continues still, with IE11 on Win7.

    The strange thing is that there are a couple of wiki articles I curate, and they have tables in them, when I add an additional row to the table and populate it, the oversupply of <br>'s doesn't seem to happen.

    e.g.: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/9539.list-of-public-microsoft-support-knowledge-base-kb-articles-for-sccm-2012-system-center-configuration-manager.aspx?PageIndex=3

    But this GP article is driving me nuts with all the superfluous <br>'s, to the point where I thought I'd convert the whole body into a table (in case tables are somehow protected from this <br> bloat), but sadly the <br> disease seems to be following me here too :(
    [above the first table]
    http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/4976.selected-content-relating-to-group-policy-administrative-templates-adm-and-admx.aspx

    editing in HTML mode clearly shows the excessive <br>'s
    was my crime to initially create the article from a Word doc?


    Don
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    This helps the community, keeps the forums tidy, and recognises useful contributions. Thanks!)

    Friday, March 14, 2014 7:52 AM
  • Hello all,

    the <br> tag issue is reported to the platform team.
    Because of the recent platform upgrade (forums, wiki, ...), other tasks came first...
    We're looking into it to get it fixed ASAP.

    Meanwhile, you can use the Technet Wiki toolbox to shortcut the issue.

    More information at: http://aka.ms/WikiToolbox

    The Wiki Toolbox project is located at: http://wikitoolbox.codeplex.com .

    Hope this helps,
    Peter (TNWiki Admin, TNWiki forum Admin)


    Peter Geelen (Microsoft Belgium) - Premier Field Engineer Security & Identity

    [If a post helps to resolve your issue, please click the "Mark as Answer" of that post or click Answered "Vote as helpful" button of that post.
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    Wednesday, April 2, 2014 10:59 AM
    Owner
  • Hello,

    I have found that I can prevent the extra line breaks by using IE-11's Emulation mode set to IE 8.

    To do this, hit F12 BEFORE entering the editor, and then set the Document mode to 8, and the User agent string to Internet Explorer 8.

    I have not tested other versions :)

    Here is a screenshot showing what I mean:

    Karl

    When you see answers and helpful posts, please click Vote As Helpful, Propose As Answer, and/or Mark As Answer.
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    Friday, April 18, 2014 9:01 PM
    Moderator
  • I have found that I can prevent the extra line breaks by using IE-11's Emulation mode set to IE 8.

    To do this, hit F12 BEFORE entering the editor, and then set the Document mode to 8, and the User agent string to Internet Explorer 8.

    Yay!!!

    Karl, this tip has worked for me (on Win7SP1x64+IE11).
    I had previously tried fiddling with emulating older DOCMODE but didn't for a moment imagine there would be UA-sniffing going on.

    (now, if somebody could only fix the annoying double-posting bug that's affecting TNforums, I'd be Mr. Happy-Smiley once again ;)


    Don
    (Please take a moment to "Vote as Helpful" and/or "Mark as Answer", where applicable.
    This helps the community, keeps the forums tidy, and recognises useful contributions. Thanks!)

    Saturday, May 3, 2014 6:59 AM
  • hy peter, thank's for great post !!!!
    Thursday, September 18, 2014 3:16 PM