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Need some help for understanding App-V 5.0 crucial points RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hello,

    My boss ask me to take a look on App-V. So I have started a study phase to see, if App-V is a good choice.

    This is a big french company with a full SCCM 2012 infrastructure. All's of applications are delivered via SCCM by administrators. The big question is, what App-V could bring more than the current infrastructure (which works very well).

    It's not easy to find a real and full documentation for App-V 5.0 in french. In English there is a lot of good articles, but I have some problem to have a clear vision of App-V crucial points.

    1/ Streaming process

    I need a more detailed technical explaination on this point. Wiki says that a stream application could start without all of files, and then could get the missing files, when they are needed. But in this article http://www.1e.com/blogs/2015/02/12/app-v-stream-dp-stream-question/ , author says that "No matter what portions of the app are in use, App-V streams down the entire content for use after this first execution" . So I'm lost, and I don't see the difference with "run locally"

    2/ First launch

    "First lanch" mean that a first and only one download per PC "for ever" or this operation will start again at the begining of a new session of this user ?

    3/ SCCM 2012

    My company works with SCCM 2012. There is "Master" which contains all's of applications needed for users. So when user asks for a more specific app, admin push it on the pc of this user. In that situation, is App-V could bring something ?

    4/ Is this article : http://www.1e.com/blogs/2015/02/12/app-v-stream-dp-stream-question/

    In this paragraph "You probably don’t only have desktops in play..." the author says "Worst case the content is on the DP supporting VPN and you now have a crazy App-V client losing its mind with your WAN". Could you explain that a bit more ?

    5/ Shared PC

    In the company, users could shared the same PC. So if theses users log on and ask the same app, is this app will cached twice on the PC ?

    Thanks !

    Thursday, October 22, 2015 8:44 AM

Answers

  • Couple other pro's;

    1) In PVS/VDI environments you can configure Shared Content Store Mode... meaning, your applications/data stays on the fileshare.... Only a min. percentage of your package will be downloaden (sparse files will be created).
    2) You appv packages will not see each other.... this way it's easy to deploy for instance 5 different Java Runtimes to the same computer/user. You can run them all at once, they will not interfere. You will not be able to do that with a physical install.
    3) User experience... if you've got large packages, you have to wait for installation (of course you can schedule maintenance windows, but still). With Appv they will be there almost instant. If you configure Fault streaming or feature block 1, your application will start instantly (and download the rest while using the app).
    4) Upgrades.... if you use package upgrade, only the difference will be downloaden. The user will not see a thing, it's (local) settings are still available.

    Thursday, October 22, 2015 7:22 PM
  • Some of the benefits of App-V are listed here: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/730.app-v-benefits.aspx

    Below is my personal experience.

    App-V is great in RDS Environments. Let's say some of your users needs to have "Adobe Acrobat", which is a license product. If you install it locally on each RDS Server, every user can start it. Of course you can prevent this, with Solutions like AppSense / AppLocker and manually remove global shortcuts, file type associations, etc.

    With App-V, you just assign the package to a user and no other user on this Server can "see" this application nor start it, and the shortcuts, context entries, file type associations are in place for just that user.

    Another advantage is, that your System stays "clean". Let's say you virtualize an application which has tons of distributed DLLs, Registry Entries, a lot of dependecies etc. Those are all in the app-v package and never touch your local System.

    There are a lot more benefits, but the above two are my personal favorites.


    Simon Dettling | msitproblog.com | @SimonDettling




    Thursday, October 22, 2015 11:17 AM
    Moderator
  • Thank you !

    My problem, is to find a reason, for creating package with App-V. Company doesn't use virtualization, and there's no device which use it (tablet, smartphone...). Network performance is very good, so when an admin push an app with SCCM, user recieve it very quickly. Master helps to have a unique configuration on every PC in the network.

    In that situation, I'm wondering what App-V could bring ? perhaps if the company wish to use mobile devices as tablet... but for Desktop/Laptop, could you give me some reasons ?


    It depends is the response i always give when someone asks me this. Some keypoints that give app-v a advatage is.

    centrally managed applications based on AD. It depends on the sccm structure. You maybe have the best sccm administrators in the world but still it is easier to give a application to a user, and then remove it again with app-v

    No installation for the sequenced applications for the users, no restart pending. no user that mess something up. if the user messes it up. Users can fix it them self.

    Patching and updates to applications will not bother users at all. they will not notice it at all. 

    The non-standard applications that all companies have. the ones that need 5 prereqs and then manual configuration afterwards. With app-v those will work with no extra work from helpdesk.

    Applications will follow users, with no install of the applications on the computers. so on shared computers only the users that need the application will see it.

    Master images from sccm is much easier to manage when you don't need to think about applications

    and so on. Your sccm administrator, if that is not you will fight you on all these points. I know because i used to be one. But still app-v is easier to manage and saves you allot time and money down the road.


    • Marked as answer by MrFlamby Friday, October 23, 2015 8:24 AM
    Thursday, October 22, 2015 11:32 AM
  • 1) It depends. If the App-V package is configured to download all the Content on first run, it will actually do that. If not, only the "Publishing Feature Block" is created when the App-V Package gets published. This is mostly the Shortcut and the Icon. The Rest will be loaded when the application get launched for the first time.

    2) Also depends. If you are using a non Persistent Environemnt (e.g: VDI or PVS) then the Content will be redownloaded every time, because the Content gets lost when you reboot the server. You can optimize this via Pre-Caching the applications for a faster first Launch.

    3) You can either integrated App-V into Configuration Manager or you use a dedicated App-V Sever-Infrastructure. If you use the integrated Approach, your Admin will deploy App-V Packages just like a normal application in ConfigMgr. If you go for the integrated Approach, you Need to make sure that your used App-V Version is compatible with ConfigMgr. For example App-V 5.1 is currently not supported (native) by Configuration Manager 2012 R2 SP1 / SP2.

    4.) I didn't read the whole article to be honest. If you have a VPN Client and a slow "Connection" and the user launches a app for the first time, the whole Content will be downloaded via VPN. You can optimize that by configuring "AutoLoad" via GPO for example, so the App-V Client will download the Content as soon as the app gets published

    5.) There is 1 Package Installation Root, where all Applications will be stored for every user. For example, if you have a Terminal Server. User 1 Logins and Open the App-V Package Notepad++. Now the Content will be downloaded to the Package Installation Root. User 2 Logins and also opens Notepad++. The Content is already present in the Package Installation Root, so the First Launch will be much faster for that user. As said at Point 2, you can optimize that by Pre-Caching all the Packages e.g. on PVS or VDI Environments.


    Simon Dettling | msitproblog.com | @SimonDettling




    Thursday, October 22, 2015 8:53 AM
    Moderator

All replies

  • 1) It depends. If the App-V package is configured to download all the Content on first run, it will actually do that. If not, only the "Publishing Feature Block" is created when the App-V Package gets published. This is mostly the Shortcut and the Icon. The Rest will be loaded when the application get launched for the first time.

    2) Also depends. If you are using a non Persistent Environemnt (e.g: VDI or PVS) then the Content will be redownloaded every time, because the Content gets lost when you reboot the server. You can optimize this via Pre-Caching the applications for a faster first Launch.

    3) You can either integrated App-V into Configuration Manager or you use a dedicated App-V Sever-Infrastructure. If you use the integrated Approach, your Admin will deploy App-V Packages just like a normal application in ConfigMgr. If you go for the integrated Approach, you Need to make sure that your used App-V Version is compatible with ConfigMgr. For example App-V 5.1 is currently not supported (native) by Configuration Manager 2012 R2 SP1 / SP2.

    4.) I didn't read the whole article to be honest. If you have a VPN Client and a slow "Connection" and the user launches a app for the first time, the whole Content will be downloaded via VPN. You can optimize that by configuring "AutoLoad" via GPO for example, so the App-V Client will download the Content as soon as the app gets published

    5.) There is 1 Package Installation Root, where all Applications will be stored for every user. For example, if you have a Terminal Server. User 1 Logins and Open the App-V Package Notepad++. Now the Content will be downloaded to the Package Installation Root. User 2 Logins and also opens Notepad++. The Content is already present in the Package Installation Root, so the First Launch will be much faster for that user. As said at Point 2, you can optimize that by Pre-Caching all the Packages e.g. on PVS or VDI Environments.


    Simon Dettling | msitproblog.com | @SimonDettling




    Thursday, October 22, 2015 8:53 AM
    Moderator
  • Thank you !

    My problem, is to find a reason, for creating package with App-V. Company doesn't use virtualization, and there's no device which use it (tablet, smartphone...). Network performance is very good, so when an admin push an app with SCCM, user recieve it very quickly. Master helps to have a unique configuration on every PC in the network.

    In that situation, I'm wondering what App-V could bring ? perhaps if the company wish to use mobile devices as tablet... but for Desktop/Laptop, could you give me some reasons ?


    • Edited by MrFlamby Thursday, October 22, 2015 9:55 AM
    Thursday, October 22, 2015 9:54 AM
  • Some of the benefits of App-V are listed here: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/730.app-v-benefits.aspx

    Below is my personal experience.

    App-V is great in RDS Environments. Let's say some of your users needs to have "Adobe Acrobat", which is a license product. If you install it locally on each RDS Server, every user can start it. Of course you can prevent this, with Solutions like AppSense / AppLocker and manually remove global shortcuts, file type associations, etc.

    With App-V, you just assign the package to a user and no other user on this Server can "see" this application nor start it, and the shortcuts, context entries, file type associations are in place for just that user.

    Another advantage is, that your System stays "clean". Let's say you virtualize an application which has tons of distributed DLLs, Registry Entries, a lot of dependecies etc. Those are all in the app-v package and never touch your local System.

    There are a lot more benefits, but the above two are my personal favorites.


    Simon Dettling | msitproblog.com | @SimonDettling




    Thursday, October 22, 2015 11:17 AM
    Moderator
  • Thank you !

    My problem, is to find a reason, for creating package with App-V. Company doesn't use virtualization, and there's no device which use it (tablet, smartphone...). Network performance is very good, so when an admin push an app with SCCM, user recieve it very quickly. Master helps to have a unique configuration on every PC in the network.

    In that situation, I'm wondering what App-V could bring ? perhaps if the company wish to use mobile devices as tablet... but for Desktop/Laptop, could you give me some reasons ?


    It depends is the response i always give when someone asks me this. Some keypoints that give app-v a advatage is.

    centrally managed applications based on AD. It depends on the sccm structure. You maybe have the best sccm administrators in the world but still it is easier to give a application to a user, and then remove it again with app-v

    No installation for the sequenced applications for the users, no restart pending. no user that mess something up. if the user messes it up. Users can fix it them self.

    Patching and updates to applications will not bother users at all. they will not notice it at all. 

    The non-standard applications that all companies have. the ones that need 5 prereqs and then manual configuration afterwards. With app-v those will work with no extra work from helpdesk.

    Applications will follow users, with no install of the applications on the computers. so on shared computers only the users that need the application will see it.

    Master images from sccm is much easier to manage when you don't need to think about applications

    and so on. Your sccm administrator, if that is not you will fight you on all these points. I know because i used to be one. But still app-v is easier to manage and saves you allot time and money down the road.


    • Marked as answer by MrFlamby Friday, October 23, 2015 8:24 AM
    Thursday, October 22, 2015 11:32 AM
  • Couple other pro's;

    1) In PVS/VDI environments you can configure Shared Content Store Mode... meaning, your applications/data stays on the fileshare.... Only a min. percentage of your package will be downloaden (sparse files will be created).
    2) You appv packages will not see each other.... this way it's easy to deploy for instance 5 different Java Runtimes to the same computer/user. You can run them all at once, they will not interfere. You will not be able to do that with a physical install.
    3) User experience... if you've got large packages, you have to wait for installation (of course you can schedule maintenance windows, but still). With Appv they will be there almost instant. If you configure Fault streaming or feature block 1, your application will start instantly (and download the rest while using the app).
    4) Upgrades.... if you use package upgrade, only the difference will be downloaden. The user will not see a thing, it's (local) settings are still available.

    Thursday, October 22, 2015 7:22 PM
  • Thanks you for theses responses. It's greatly help me.
    Friday, October 23, 2015 8:26 AM