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Biztalk HIS 2010 Data Access Tool Mainframe File System Only SNA option Why not TCP/IP RRS feed

  • Question

  • Respected Community Members,

    I am tryign to implement/configure the New Biztalk HIS 2010 server with our Existing Mainframe environment for communication for executing CICS programs using COM component on VB Programs.

    After installation of HIS 2010, i tried using the Data Access Tools which i guess allow testing the connection. When i select Data Source Platform = "Mainframe File System"..it disable the TCP/IP option and only allow the SNA LU 6.2(APPC).

    Does anybody know why the TCP/IP is disabled??

    According to our standard here...i guess all the SNA conenctivity suppose to be shut off...and we should use only TCP/IP connectivity using TCP/IP listner program located on Mainframe CICS environment.

    Please assist as per your earliest convinient.

    Wednesday, April 11, 2012 1:10 PM

Answers

  • If you are trying to integrate usingMainframe file system, SNA LU 6.2 is the only available network transport. Accessing mainframe-based files requires IBM Data Facility Storage Management\Distributed File Manager (DFSM\DFM) on the mainframe. IBM DFSM/DFM only supports LU 6.2 (APPC) connectivity,  so direct TCP/IP connections are not possible. 

    You can use the IP-DLC link service included in HIS 2010 to connect to the IBM mainframe system. The IP-DLC link service integrates with IBM Enterprise Extender ont he mainframe to allow the SNA traffic (such as APPC) to flow over IP connections. IP-DLC and Enterprise Extender actaully use UDP.

    The following link is the HIS 2010 documentation that mentions that DFSM/DFS requires LU 6.2 (APPC):

    http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/gg166260.aspx

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Monday, April 16, 2012 7:20 PM
    Wednesday, April 11, 2012 5:57 PM
  • Nick,

    If you are calling CICS applications from the Windows side, then you would be using Windows-Initiated Processing (WIP), not Host-Initiated Processing (HIP). HIP allows you to have CICS applications call a Windows application.

    If you are intrested in HIP, then please refer to the following as a starting point:

    Host-Initiated Processing

    Working with Host-Initiated Processing

      - Check out the Creating a Local Environment and Creating a Host Environment subtopics under this topic.

    Programming Host-Initiated Processing

    Host-Initiated Processing Samples

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Monday, April 16, 2012 7:20 PM
    Friday, April 13, 2012 6:57 PM
  • Once you have converted the assembly, you can use it on the production HIS 2010 Server without Visual Studio.

    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Wednesday, April 18, 2012 10:14 PM
    Monday, April 16, 2012 7:26 PM
  • No. If you are connecting via TCP/IP, you don't need to go through the rest of the SNA Gateway configuration in SNA Manager. You don't need any link services or APPC LUs.

    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Monday, April 16, 2012 8:18 PM
    Monday, April 16, 2012 7:29 PM
  • That should do it. There are always cases of things that don't work correctly due to changes that have been made over time to Transaction Integrator.

    For example, the following change that was made in HIS 2004 has caught a number of customers when they upgrade from HIS 2000 to HIS 2004 or later:

    891297 FIX: You cannot define a method parameter as an unsigned numeric data type (PIC 9) in the Transaction Integrator Designer of Microsoft Host Integration Server 2004
    http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;891297

    This is just meant to let you know that there are some things that you might encounter during the upgrade even when you use the conversion tool to convert the old TLB.

    You should also make sure that you are aware of the other considerations listed under http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/gg162855.aspx when using the conversion tool.

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Wednesday, April 18, 2012 10:14 PM
    Monday, April 16, 2012 8:35 PM
  • Nick,

    Not sure of the exact steps you performed. Converting the TLB via the TIConversionTool wouldn't add anything into Component Services. It simply creates a .NET Assembly (DLL) that can be used with TI.

    Were you trying to install your COM+ application on the HIS systme that you did the conversion on in order to complete some other step?

    Once you have the .NET Assembly you cna take that to the HIS system that you want to run the TI application on and then use the Assembly on that system.

    If this continues to occur, you might want to provide the exact steps that you are doing that lead to the error.

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Wednesday, April 18, 2012 10:14 PM
    Wednesday, April 18, 2012 8:48 PM

All replies

  • If you are trying to integrate usingMainframe file system, SNA LU 6.2 is the only available network transport. Accessing mainframe-based files requires IBM Data Facility Storage Management\Distributed File Manager (DFSM\DFM) on the mainframe. IBM DFSM/DFM only supports LU 6.2 (APPC) connectivity,  so direct TCP/IP connections are not possible. 

    You can use the IP-DLC link service included in HIS 2010 to connect to the IBM mainframe system. The IP-DLC link service integrates with IBM Enterprise Extender ont he mainframe to allow the SNA traffic (such as APPC) to flow over IP connections. IP-DLC and Enterprise Extender actaully use UDP.

    The following link is the HIS 2010 documentation that mentions that DFSM/DFS requires LU 6.2 (APPC):

    http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/gg166260.aspx

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Monday, April 16, 2012 7:20 PM
    Wednesday, April 11, 2012 5:57 PM
  • Stephen,

              1> In order to execute the CICS program on mainframe from my VB Program COMTI object, does Ip-DLC and SNA LU connectivity are the only 2 option?? what does HIS 2010 TCP/IP support is for??

              2>   So in order to migrate existing COMTI component from HIS 2000, do i need to make any changes to existing COMTI component??

              3>   Does COMTI component needs to be converted to .NET assembly or it should work as it is??

    Thanks,

    Nick

    Thursday, April 12, 2012 2:33 AM
  • Nick,

    1) The original post was asking about the ability to connect directly via TCP/IP using the OLE DB Provider for AS/400 and VSAM (i.e. the Host File provider). This has nothing to do with Transaction Integrator (formerly called COMTI). Transaction Integrator can be used with direct TCP/IP connections as well as over LU 6.2 (APPC) sessions.

    2) The following features were removed from Transaction Integrator in HIS 2010 (See Removed Features under http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/gg167635.aspx):

    - Transaction Integrator support for Component Object Model (COM) libraries has been removed from Host Integration Server. You should use the Transaction Integrator Designer to convert COM type libraries to .NET assemblies, and then re-deploy the components.

  • - Transaction Integrator support for .NET Remoting has been removed from Host Integration Server. You should use the HIS support for direct .NET calls.

    So, the answer is yes. Changes will need to be made. At the very least, you will need to convert the components using the conversion tool if you don't want to make new assemblies.

    3) If possible, the best course of action is to move to using .NET Assemblies since COM has been removed.

    You can use the TIConversionTool.exe utility to convert previously created TLBs and .NET Assemblies to HIS 2010 .NET Assemblies. Take a look at http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/gg162855.aspx for some information on the conversion tool.

    Even though the article doesn't mention HIS 2006 or later, the information is still relevant when migrating older TLBs.

    886300 How to migrate type libraries from SNA Server 4.0 Service Pack 4 and Host Integration Server 2000 Service Pack 1 to Host Integration Server 2004
    http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;886300

    Many customers that are migrating use the TIConversionTool to convert their TLBs or older .NET Assemblies to minimize the changes needed to get their applications to work on HIS 2010.

    Thanks...


  • Stephen Jackson - MSFT

Thursday, April 12, 2012 1:29 PM
  • The original post was asking about the ability to connect directly via TCP/IP using the OLE DB Provider for AS/400 and VSAM (i.e. the Host File provider). This has nothing to do with Transaction Integrator (formerly called COMTI). Transaction Integrator can be used with direct TCP/IP connections as well as over LU 6.2 (APPC) sessions.

    Stephen, First of all thanks a lot for giving instant guidance.

               On your above comments regarding point 1, looks like in HIS 2000 Transaction Integration there were below options connecting to mainframe:-

    1> CICS and IMS using TCP/IP

    2> CICS link using LU 6.2

    3> CICS using LU 6.2

    4> IMS using LU 6.2

    5> IMS using OTMA

    So when we select TCP/IP ...there is no SNA connections come in picture?? ...or that is something i misunderstood here...

    Thanks,

    Nick

    Thursday, April 12, 2012 6:47 PM
  • Correct. If you configure TI to connect via TCP/IP, it connects using TCP/IP sockets. It does not use the LU 6.2 (APPC) or SNA connections at all.

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    Thursday, April 12, 2012 9:03 PM
  • So ..in Biztalk HIS 2010 if i use the Transaction Integrator Host Initiated processing, what option do i need to created for TCP/IP connected functionality???

    Please assist in steps here.

    Thursday, April 12, 2012 9:52 PM
  • Nick,

    If you are calling CICS applications from the Windows side, then you would be using Windows-Initiated Processing (WIP), not Host-Initiated Processing (HIP). HIP allows you to have CICS applications call a Windows application.

    If you are intrested in HIP, then please refer to the following as a starting point:

    Host-Initiated Processing

    Working with Host-Initiated Processing

      - Check out the Creating a Local Environment and Creating a Host Environment subtopics under this topic.

    Programming Host-Initiated Processing

    Host-Initiated Processing Samples

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Monday, April 16, 2012 7:20 PM
    Friday, April 13, 2012 6:57 PM
  • Stephen,

    Thanks for the guidance..here...but according to your different between WIP and HIP , i guess i am interested in WIP... which i got the some documents from the above link you provided.

    One more quey for you is ...When i try to use TIConvertionTool on the command prompt, it says the "it does not recognized as internal or external commmand"!!!!!!!

    Any idea..should i install separate temple to use that feature??

    Thanks,

    Nick

    Monday, April 16, 2012 4:20 PM
  • Nick,

    The conversion tool gets installed to the %SNARootWow64% folder (C:\Program Files\Microsoft Host Integration Server 2010\SysWOW64). In addition, you need to have installed the Design Tools option under the Server component when installing HIS 2010 to get the conversion tool installed. The Design Tools option will be installed if you have Visual Studio installed on the system. Otherwise that option won't install.

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    Monday, April 16, 2012 4:35 PM
  • Looks like visual studio is installed on my developer box and after installing HIS 2010 snippet...it has... the TIConversionTool ...so if i convert the assembly on developer box and then if i use that converted assebly on production box with only HIS 2010 (not with Visual studio)...then should that work fine???
    Monday, April 16, 2012 4:49 PM
  • Once you have converted the assembly, you can use it on the production HIS 2010 Server without Visual Studio.

    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Wednesday, April 18, 2012 10:14 PM
    Monday, April 16, 2012 7:26 PM
  • Stephen,

             If i am usign the TCP/IP WIP process under Transaction Integrator .....

            Still do i need to configure the SNA manager configuration such as link service, sna service and LU set up...and stuff like that??? Areboth the set up required??

    Thanks,

    Nick

    Monday, April 16, 2012 7:27 PM
  • No. If you are connecting via TCP/IP, you don't need to go through the rest of the SNA Gateway configuration in SNA Manager. You don't need any link services or APPC LUs.

    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Monday, April 16, 2012 8:18 PM
    Monday, April 16, 2012 7:29 PM
  • Ok...great...then TCp/IP settings should be straight forward.....

    1> Just set up tcp/ip port and ip settings in WIP-Transaction Integrator tool

    2> use TIConversionTool to convert TLB files into .NET assembly

    3> add those dll to WIP Objects list through wizard

    4> call that wip object methods from existing VB programs...

    Please verify the steps......

    Monday, April 16, 2012 8:21 PM
  • That should do it. There are always cases of things that don't work correctly due to changes that have been made over time to Transaction Integrator.

    For example, the following change that was made in HIS 2004 has caught a number of customers when they upgrade from HIS 2000 to HIS 2004 or later:

    891297 FIX: You cannot define a method parameter as an unsigned numeric data type (PIC 9) in the Transaction Integrator Designer of Microsoft Host Integration Server 2004
    http://support.microsoft.com/default.aspx?scid=kb;EN-US;891297

    This is just meant to let you know that there are some things that you might encounter during the upgrade even when you use the conversion tool to convert the old TLB.

    You should also make sure that you are aware of the other considerations listed under http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/gg162855.aspx when using the conversion tool.

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Wednesday, April 18, 2012 10:14 PM
    Monday, April 16, 2012 8:35 PM
  • Stephen,

                hey while trying the tcp/ip settings on Transaction TI manager WIP remote environment, i did install the convrter .NET assebly from existing TLB file.

    After doing that it added entry into Component services. While exporting that component services Application...it display below message:-

    "Error occurred writing to the application file. Either the path cannot be accessed or an existing file cannot be overwritten. Make sure you entered the full path for the application definition file. The application was not exported."

    Any idea what could be wrong?????

    Thanks,

    Nick

    Wednesday, April 18, 2012 7:39 PM
  • Nick,

    Not sure of the exact steps you performed. Converting the TLB via the TIConversionTool wouldn't add anything into Component Services. It simply creates a .NET Assembly (DLL) that can be used with TI.

    Were you trying to install your COM+ application on the HIS systme that you did the conversion on in order to complete some other step?

    Once you have the .NET Assembly you cna take that to the HIS system that you want to run the TI application on and then use the Assembly on that system.

    If this continues to occur, you might want to provide the exact steps that you are doing that lead to the error.

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    • Marked as answer by Nicksoft2011 Wednesday, April 18, 2012 10:14 PM
    Wednesday, April 18, 2012 8:48 PM
  • stephen,

                once i import the dll into TI manager...How do i use that assembly from VB program or VB.NET program.???

              Do we have any code exmples that how do we call the DLL assembly that we deploy into TI manager??

                please assist.

    Thanks,

    Nick

    Wednesday, April 18, 2012 10:14 PM
  • Nick,

    Most of the examples in the HIS 2010 SDK for TI are C# samples, but the following include VB or VB.NET:

    SDK\Samples\ApplicationIntegration\WindowsInitiated\BasicScenarios (The VBNetClient folder includes a VB .NET client sample).

    SDK\Samples\ApplicationIntegration\WindowsInitiated\BoundedDataTables

    You might want to start by looking at these samples to see if they provide the information that you are looking for.

    Thanks...


    Stephen Jackson - MSFT

    Thursday, April 19, 2012 2:22 PM
  • I am struggling with Multiple values returned from the CICS side.....

    i guess the new TI designed allows only one return value....

    But the old way we did is when we call CICS Program from COMTI..it actually have 2 out parameters..one for error code and one for error message..

    Does that gonna be any issue or defining multiple parameters..is just fine...we don't need to define any retunr parameter??

    Please assist.

    Monday, April 30, 2012 3:53 PM