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Future of Logic Apps RRS feed

  • Question

  • Hi Experts

    Recent days i heard from people that BizTalk dont have future.It is very hard to digest these kind of words.

    Just wanted to know what is the future of BizTalk and Logic Apps.

    Please share your valuable suggestions.

    Sunday, August 21, 2016 1:12 AM

Answers

  • Hi Ammu_Biz,

    I would not think so . In fact look like logic apps - Enterprise Integration Pack is utilizing the BizTalk messaging and transformation concepts . Look at the picture below explaining EIP architecture,

    May be both are going to work more in conjugation eventually .

    Some learning resources in Logic apps below. I think it is a good idea to start doing some POC at this time around logic apps, I am sure BizTalkers will find this a familiar terrain.  MS Azure BizTalk services is also something we should be interested in. Best Of Luck. Keep the community informed on what new you can find :-)

    Regards Pushpendra K Singh

    Sunday, August 21, 2016 2:02 AM
  • Hi Ammu,

    BizTalk is not dead, very much alive and kicking.

    The Azure integration approach and new BizTalk Server product roadmap details are referenced in this Microsoft white paper - Roadmap

    Here is the snippet:

    Microsoft Integration Roadmap

    Microsoft has promised:

    1) Continued commitment to BizTalk Server. BizTalk Server 2016 planned for Q4 2016.

    2) The cloud iPaaS offering will see a refresh in Jan 2016, and GA in April 2016.

    3) On premise (Azure Stack) version of iPaaS will be in preview by Q2 2016.

    4) Host Integration vnext will be inline with BizTalk Server release.

    Refer: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/33250.microsoft-integration-roadmap.aspx

    Microsoft is planning to establish future "parity" between its Logic Apps and BizTalk Services. Logic Apps, though, will get the focus, going forward, according to the white paper.

    "Customers should be assured with our approach that we fully intend to provide all the capabilities they have today in BizTalk Services represented in our Logic Apps and App Service offering," the white paper explained. "Therefore, for new integration solutions we recommend customers target Logic Apps for their cloud-based integration workloads."

    While Logic Apps are currently offered as part of the Azure App Service, Microsoft is planning to make Logic Apps available for use on premises, too, either from the customer's datacenter or from the infrastructure of a hosting provider. Logic Apps will be enabled in this way via Azure Stack, a bundle of APIs and tools consistent between Azure infrastructure and Microsoft's 2016 server products. 

    A key enabler of this story is Azure Stack.  Without it we will not see the new Logic App assets running in your own data center.  Microsoft is targeting an “IPaaS” preview in Q2 2016 and GA by end of the 2016.

    image_thumb[1]

    The great guns have discussed this in detail:

    Steef-Jan Wiggers: https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/wikininjas/2015/12/27/the-road-ahead-for-microsoft-integration/

    Kent Weare: http://kentweare.blogspot.in/2015/12/my-point-of-view-microsoft-releases.html

    Saravana Kumar: http://blogs.biztalk360.com/what-is-the-microsoft-integration-roadmap/


    Rachit Sikroria (Microsoft Azure MVP)

    Sunday, August 21, 2016 3:29 AM
    Moderator
  • Hi

    BizTalk server is still the best on-premises integration platform available today, and that is not changing anytime soon. Microsoft is still committed to release a new version of BizTalk Server around about every 2 years or so. BizTalk 2016 is expected to be released in Q4 of 2016.

    Few factors that weigh in favour of BizTalk Server-

    1) Over 10,000 customers worldwide have their integration solutions on BizTalk Server, many of these are Fortune 500 companies.

    2) The current capabilities on Logic Apps are only a subset of those available in BizTalk Server.

    3) BizTalk 2016 includes a Logic Apps adapter that would enable on-prem BizTalk to connect to Logic Apps. This will enable hybrid scenarios where some part of your integration solution will run in your datacenter, and some portion of the solution would run in Microsoft Azure. These hybrid scenarios would be a key enabler for many organisations going forward.

    Having said that, the Product Group is making most of it's investment in Logic Apps. Note that BizTalk Server is a very mature product and has a full-blown set of integration capabilities - there aren't too many gaps in the product. So it's better not to speculate that BizTalk Server has no future just because Logic Apps are here - both will enable different types of integration scenarios. In some cases, both would be leveraged to create hybrid integration solutions as mentioned earlier.


    Thanks Arindam

    • Proposed as answer by - Anand - Sunday, August 21, 2016 7:23 PM
    • Marked as answer by Angie Xu Wednesday, August 31, 2016 3:07 AM
    Sunday, August 21, 2016 4:39 AM
    Moderator

All replies

  • Hi Ammu_Biz,

    I would not think so . In fact look like logic apps - Enterprise Integration Pack is utilizing the BizTalk messaging and transformation concepts . Look at the picture below explaining EIP architecture,

    May be both are going to work more in conjugation eventually .

    Some learning resources in Logic apps below. I think it is a good idea to start doing some POC at this time around logic apps, I am sure BizTalkers will find this a familiar terrain.  MS Azure BizTalk services is also something we should be interested in. Best Of Luck. Keep the community informed on what new you can find :-)

    Regards Pushpendra K Singh

    Sunday, August 21, 2016 2:02 AM
  • Hi Ammu,

    BizTalk is not dead, very much alive and kicking.

    The Azure integration approach and new BizTalk Server product roadmap details are referenced in this Microsoft white paper - Roadmap

    Here is the snippet:

    Microsoft Integration Roadmap

    Microsoft has promised:

    1) Continued commitment to BizTalk Server. BizTalk Server 2016 planned for Q4 2016.

    2) The cloud iPaaS offering will see a refresh in Jan 2016, and GA in April 2016.

    3) On premise (Azure Stack) version of iPaaS will be in preview by Q2 2016.

    4) Host Integration vnext will be inline with BizTalk Server release.

    Refer: http://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/33250.microsoft-integration-roadmap.aspx

    Microsoft is planning to establish future "parity" between its Logic Apps and BizTalk Services. Logic Apps, though, will get the focus, going forward, according to the white paper.

    "Customers should be assured with our approach that we fully intend to provide all the capabilities they have today in BizTalk Services represented in our Logic Apps and App Service offering," the white paper explained. "Therefore, for new integration solutions we recommend customers target Logic Apps for their cloud-based integration workloads."

    While Logic Apps are currently offered as part of the Azure App Service, Microsoft is planning to make Logic Apps available for use on premises, too, either from the customer's datacenter or from the infrastructure of a hosting provider. Logic Apps will be enabled in this way via Azure Stack, a bundle of APIs and tools consistent between Azure infrastructure and Microsoft's 2016 server products. 

    A key enabler of this story is Azure Stack.  Without it we will not see the new Logic App assets running in your own data center.  Microsoft is targeting an “IPaaS” preview in Q2 2016 and GA by end of the 2016.

    image_thumb[1]

    The great guns have discussed this in detail:

    Steef-Jan Wiggers: https://blogs.technet.microsoft.com/wikininjas/2015/12/27/the-road-ahead-for-microsoft-integration/

    Kent Weare: http://kentweare.blogspot.in/2015/12/my-point-of-view-microsoft-releases.html

    Saravana Kumar: http://blogs.biztalk360.com/what-is-the-microsoft-integration-roadmap/


    Rachit Sikroria (Microsoft Azure MVP)

    Sunday, August 21, 2016 3:29 AM
    Moderator
  • Hi

    BizTalk server is still the best on-premises integration platform available today, and that is not changing anytime soon. Microsoft is still committed to release a new version of BizTalk Server around about every 2 years or so. BizTalk 2016 is expected to be released in Q4 of 2016.

    Few factors that weigh in favour of BizTalk Server-

    1) Over 10,000 customers worldwide have their integration solutions on BizTalk Server, many of these are Fortune 500 companies.

    2) The current capabilities on Logic Apps are only a subset of those available in BizTalk Server.

    3) BizTalk 2016 includes a Logic Apps adapter that would enable on-prem BizTalk to connect to Logic Apps. This will enable hybrid scenarios where some part of your integration solution will run in your datacenter, and some portion of the solution would run in Microsoft Azure. These hybrid scenarios would be a key enabler for many organisations going forward.

    Having said that, the Product Group is making most of it's investment in Logic Apps. Note that BizTalk Server is a very mature product and has a full-blown set of integration capabilities - there aren't too many gaps in the product. So it's better not to speculate that BizTalk Server has no future just because Logic Apps are here - both will enable different types of integration scenarios. In some cases, both would be leveraged to create hybrid integration solutions as mentioned earlier.


    Thanks Arindam

    • Proposed as answer by - Anand - Sunday, August 21, 2016 7:23 PM
    • Marked as answer by Angie Xu Wednesday, August 31, 2016 3:07 AM
    Sunday, August 21, 2016 4:39 AM
    Moderator
  • Hi Ammu_Biz,

    Apart from the reading others have suggestedd, which is offcourse comprehensive,

    I suggest you go through some of the videos by Biztalk 360 for the Integrate events,

    some of the links are

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwY-hWTI4c4

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UZFCdVM5Xa0

    http://www.biztalk360.com/integrate-2016-resources/

    Do believe that Biztalk is here to stay reasons

    1) Microsoft caters to a large number of clients with its Biztalk server product

    2) Clients have a lot of money invested in the Infra and Software licensing and the development done till date...so it is not possible to switch off the on-Prem Biztalk and just go up to the cloud..

    3) Hence MS has introduced the concept of Hybrid Integration...where there is integration between your Onprem systems and elements hosted on cloud...

    4) There are lot of legacy systems Like SAP, IBM which cannot just port themselves to cloud and hence Biztalk needs to be there to integrate with them on Prem...

    So I personally feel that on-Prem Biztalk is going to be there for next few years..why..the release of Biztalk 2016 makes me sure of it.

    AS for logic apps, yes they are going to be important part of the future Microsoft is putting a lot of efforts in the Cloud ..but still Biztalk is going to be there for a couple of years...!!!

    Regards,


    Mandar Dharmadhikari

    Sunday, August 21, 2016 6:28 AM
    Moderator
  • What people?

    Historically, BizTalk Server will outlast LogicApps* or whatever replaces it.  Also, BizTalk Server will outlast any of the competition in the integration space.  It already has.

    BizTalk Server will be sold and supported for a very long time since, in practice, there is no viable replacement from Microsoft or anyone else.  Every competitive offering I've seen latest barely matches BizTalk Server 2006.

    Eventually, Service Bus/Logic Apps will grow to about 90% coverage of what BizTalk Server does today, then it may be a coin toss.

    *I'm more optimistic about LogicApp than any attempt since WF so hopefully they stay the course on this one.

    • Proposed as answer by - Anand - Sunday, August 21, 2016 7:25 PM
    Sunday, August 21, 2016 12:03 PM
    Moderator
  • What people?

    Historically, BizTalk Server will outlast LogicApps* or whatever replaces it.  Also, BizTalk Server will outlast any of the competition in the integration space.  It already has.

    BizTalk Server will be sold and supported for a very long time since, in practice, there is no viable replacement from Microsoft or anyone else.  Every competitive offering I've seen latest barely matches BizTalk Server 2006.

    Eventually, Service Bus/Logic Apps will grow to about 90% coverage of what BizTalk Server does today, then it may be a coin toss.

    *I'm more optimistic about LogicApp than any attempt since WF so hopefully they stay the course on this one.

    "BizTalk will outlast any of the competition" ----  I like the sound of what you wrote Johns. THANKS.

    Regards Pushpendra K Singh

    Sunday, August 21, 2016 3:30 PM
  • Hey guys i have second thought on Logic Apps...

    I have been working on Microsoft technology since 2006. I was bit happy with the news that Logic apps is the replacement for BizTalk, :( but that is not true.

    I have just started learning Logic Apps and may be few of my comments could be wrong.

    First of all Logic Apps is kind of service/workflow which you can consume or utilize in Azure... Means you cannot use it in AWS or Google etc cloud.

    This clearly indicates that it cannot cover integration of applications on other cloud providers.. for example if i want to integrate applications running on Clould other than Azure.

    For complex integration it provides connectors to BizTalk. Now here is the catch.. for each action you need to pay as you go.

    Second you have to bear cost of both azure transaction and BizTalk License. If everyone is moving to cloud why they will keep BizTalk on their onpremise

    Thursday, March 30, 2017 10:44 PM
  • Hi All,

    I have been doing a series of interviews with experts, recently with Tord -- http://tech-findings.blogspot.in/2016/12/biztalk-expert-interview-tord.html

    From the interviews and in my opinion, we are getting more options but its not that BizTalk is dead or getting replaced.

    Friday, March 31, 2017 1:11 PM
  • BizTalk is one of the best tool for on premise. As everyone is moving to clould either it need to add more feature, so that it can support on cloud.

    Logic App is the one of the Azure service which cannot be used outside Azure platform. 


    Friday, March 31, 2017 7:03 PM

  • Hi Ammu_Biz and other followers of this question,

    Once in a while, we also receive such questions from our customers asking "Is Microsoft going to retire BizTalk Server and replace it with Azure Logic Apps?" What we believe is that this is a confusion caused by the retirement of "Microsoft Azure BizTalk Services (MABS)". Here is an interesting article written by Saravana, Microsoft Azure MVP answering the question for Is Microsoft going to retire BizTalk Server? https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/microsoft-going-retire-biztalk-server-saravana-kumar/

    In this article, he clearly quotes one of his conversation with Tord Glad Nordahl (Program Manager for BizTalk Server at that time).

    Regards

    Mohan

    Tuesday, April 24, 2018 7:25 AM